How to get a raise?

Ok, I'm happy-ish at work. The only real issue is the pay. I got a raise last year and want a fairly substantial raise this year or I'd start looking. I've been told that the only wait to get a substantial raise (more than 3-5%) is threaten to leave, or in some cases leave and come back. I don't really want to play those games, but I'm underpaid and it's hard to be happy when you know you could be making 10% or more somewhere else.
A former employer called me last night and offered me a job. It would be more than 10% more and I could walk to work again. Here's the deal though. I don't want that job. I'd take it if I lost this job though.
So, the way I see it, I have leverage that I could use to get the raise I want/deserve. My wife said go through the interview process with the former employer, get a job offer and use that to get more $$$ with the current. I don't want to go through the interview process with a job that I don't want, plus I don't think there'd be one. They'd just say "when do you wanna start." I'm thinking, just go to my current boss and tell him I have a job offer that is attractive and that I'm thinking about taking it. Let them show how much they want me to stay. The only real issue with that is, if they tell me they can only give me a small raise or none at all, it could backfire.
I'm not very good an manipulating people, what would you do?

My son just did that. Comfy in a job making $70k, well established clientele, set routines and good business relationships. Shop A found his two year old resume and contacted him, asked for a sit down.

He interviewed with a young company that is expanding fast and they want a young, energenic person to drive their primary shop. He thanked them but declined, the money wasn't there. Three days later they countered with money and bonuses. They pick up his cell phone bill, perhaps the car payment and in two years he will get another shop, making him a regional director making more $$$.

He put in his notice where he's been for four years. They balked, made counter offers, promises and bumped his pay to $85,000 immediately. He retracted his resignation.

The place he works started back peddling on the promises.

Where do you see yourself in five years? Ten years? Shop A called again, with nothing to lose he was more relaxed and sitting pretty when he spoke with them again. He took the job.

15 minute drive to work vs one hour each way into Manhattan.

Very promising company!

Clientele are 35 - 45 year olds with dfisposable income.

I would do it Doctor. At the very least you lose nothing, you already have a job; and this gives you the opportunity to hone your negotiating skills.

Dan

I don't see how this could backfire depending on what's more important to you.

Is it having a job you like? Or is it making substantially more money?

If it's having a job you like then be prepared to back down.

If it's making more money, let them know you have another offer, and if they can't do anything for you in terms of money, walk on down to the new job and enjoy the money.

That said, i don't know what it's like to have a job you enjoy, so i'm purely driven by money and nothing else in an employment scenario.

3-5c? You greedy pig! Ten years and or guys got 24c!

Go to your boss and ask for a raise. Explain why you deserve it, with hard numbers/facts. That said, the only way to get a really good raise it to switch companies.

Trying to play the bidding game will just make people at both companies dislike you.

Datsun1500 wrote: I have employees, so I will answer this from that angle. If you play games with me and waste my time, you will lose. It is not worth the headache. This means as the guy that is offering the new job, if you do the whole process and use it only to stay at the existing job, you will never get another offer from me. As the existing employer, if you threaten to leave, or actually leave, you will never get another raise from me, and most of the time will be told to go, since you are not happy here. It is about being an adult, and cutting through the BS. If you came to me and said I have another company that wants to offer me a job, it is more money, but I like this job better, we could have a 5 minute conversation and come to an agreement. It might be a raise, benefit, or telling you I can't or won't match the offer, and why. Either way it will be solved in 5 minutes, not days.... and if you keep your current job, let the new guy know you do not want to move at this time. one to one, no BS conversation, results in a resolution that both are happy with, and 95% of the time it is with staying on here. Playing games and trying to manipulate me results in you losing your job every time.

This is how I feel. I don't want to play one against the other. I am leaning towards telling my current employer I'm happy where I am, but I have an offer that will pay (I just found out) about 13% more. I'd like to stay, but I have a family to consider.
The truth is, I don't want the job being offered but I hope I can use it to get a raise. But I do want to avoid the BS games.

I hope you are good at walking on eggshells. In this economy and on the surface, you are in a lose/lose situation. Either you will have a job or you won't. "Happiness" or money?

I don't own a company but manage people.

1. If you tell me you have a job offer with a known salary already - that tells me you are unhappy and looking. Or at least entertaining leaving me and have listened to other companies.

2. I won't counter offer - I would strongly suggest you leave and take the new pay. You said you will hate to take this bluff.

3. I would just sit down with the current employer and ask for a raise.

Datsun310Guy wrote: 3. I would just sit down with the current employer and ask for a raise.

This is probably your best course. Forget the other job and their offer. That will just make the situation worse, even if you PROFUSELY expound that they contacted you first.

Ask for a million dollar raise and when they balk tell them you will settle for 20%. Win!

Replace the words "job and boss" with "wife, girlfriend, relationship."
Lets face it, you have a relationship with work which is not really that unlike the dating world. If you told a current girlfriend that you were considering a different girl, ugly situations arise.
It is better to gently work on that relationship where each of you changes a little to make the overall better.

Or sit down with the other employer and tell them your primary reason for wanting to look else-where is less than competitive pay. If they give you an offer, demand to know what the starting salary will be, benefits, etc.

In the event the offer is good and you do leave your current job, your boss will likely ask you why you left. You'll just say "20% raise" and either he'll want to keep you and realize your underpaid, or he'll let you go.

Don't try to do this pit one employer against the other thing. Bad idea.

I would make it very clear to your current employer that you were not looking, but someone "found" you (I know, its an old relationship, but you dont have to be that transparent), and made you an offer. Youre happy where you are, but, as mentioned above, you have a family to think of. Se what happens. At least youre being honest, up front, and mature - not playing games and trying to be manipulative. They may understand, they may tell you to hit the bricks...but, much like agreeing to meet a craigslist seller, you have to be willing to take whatever comes out of the conversation...which may include walking away. If youre not willing to walk away, dont have the conversation.

I am terrible at asking for raises. I got promoted last year without a raise (had a small raise the year before with no promotion). I just got told today I am switching teams, which is basically going to set me up to learn a whole new range of tasks and responsibilities to further my career development and knowledge in my field. I can only hope to get another raise when my next review comes up.

JohnRW1621 wrote: Replace the words "job and boss" with "wife, girlfriend, relationship." Lets face it, you have a relationship with work which is not really that unlike the dating world. If you told a current girlfriend that you were considering a different girl, ugly situations arise. It is better to gently work on that relationship where each of you changes a little to make the overall better.

lol yes, its much like having a girlfriend..."you vill take vat I geeev you, and you vill like eet!!! lol - you have little to no control over the situation and you do all the work for little or no praise

Datsun1500 pretty much said what I was going to say, that's how it is in IT at least. To get a raise these days you generally have to change jobs or threaten to do so. So you have 3 options:

1. The safe but mostly futile option: Just ask your boss for a raise, make a case for it. You'll almost certainly get turned down but maybe it's worth a shot.

2. The less safe option: Tell your boss you've got a job offer for more money and negotiate a match. If you work at a company where HR does the hiring this could put you on the E36 M3 list however and it will let your company know you're not a pushover in terms of compensation, in a world full of unemployed Gen. Y'ers who will work for dog biscuits...not great.

3. The bridge burner: Tell your boss you've got a job offer for more money and you're going to take it unless you match the pay - which you must follow through with. This will certainly put you on the E36 M3 list unless you're some kind of rock star.

Datsun1500 wrote: I have employees, so I will answer this from that angle. If you play games with me and waste my time, you will lose. It is not worth the headache. This means as the guy that is offering the new job, if you do the whole process and use it only to stay at the existing job, you will never get another offer from me. As the existing employer, if you threaten to leave, or actually leave, you will never get another raise from me, and most of the time will be told to go, since you are not happy here. It is about being an adult, and cutting through the BS. If you came to me and said I have another company that wants to offer me a job, it is more money, but I like this job better, we could have a 5 minute conversation and come to an agreement. It might be a raise, benefit, or telling you I can't or won't match the offer, and why. Either way it will be solved in 5 minutes, not days.... and if you keep your current job, let the new guy know you do not want to move at this time. one to one, no BS conversation, results in a resolution that both are happy with, and 95% of the time it is with staying on here. Playing games and trying to manipulate me results in you losing your job every time.

Very well put. At my current job, I haven't had a raise in over 6 years, but neither has anyone else (that I know of). Here if you ask for a raise and/or mention you are looking elsewhere, you will most likely be shown the door, maybe not immediately, but soon after. So tread carefully.

rotard wrote: That said, the only way to get a really good raise it to switch companies.

Sadly, I have found this to be true.

Make damn sure the other offer is real. Have a straightforward discussion with your current employer but don't mention the other offer, it is your backup plan. Present your case on why you deserve more money in terms that are quantifiable. If you come to a satisfactory agreement, great. If you don't, accept the other offer, get paper from them in writing and put in your resignation 1st thing the next day. Don't entertain counter offers. You have already dealt with them honorably on your merits and they were not moved. No regrets.

Datsun1500 wrote: I have employees, so I will answer this from that angle. If you play games with me and waste my time, you will lose. It is not worth the headache.

I think it depends on the world you work in. In a small shop with personal relationships, that may be all there is and all you'll get paid. Anything else is seen as games and you're done.

However, in larger companies, and those with HR, this is most definitely not true. I have worked in HR, and I have been the one negotiating a raise for myself. HR doesn't make decisions this way when they have to downsize or promote, so you get to play the same hardball tactics back to maximize your personal benefit. That said, don't bullE36 M3... get a real offer, then use that as traction.

4cylndrfury wrote: ...Youre happy where you are, but, as mentioned above, you have a family to think of. Se what happens. At least youre being honest, up front, and mature - ......which may include walking away. If youre not willing to walk away, dont have the conversation.

This is a very good tact to add to the conversation. This is essentially what I did. I was at one company, fairly happy, but interviewed with a company closer to home, and for $10K more per year. I sat down with my boss after getting the offer, they didn't want to lose me, and we negotiated a healthy raise with a gentleman's agreement that I would stay at least another 2 years. That said, this was at a 200+ employee company.

I'm in IT and as several people already mentioned, in this business at least it is very hard to get a raise without changing jobs. That said, when I got a promotion earlier this year I did get a raise in proportion with the new responsibilities so there are employers out there who are trying to do the right thing (IMHO).

I would start looking at the pay rise negotiations from a different perspective and first check places like payscale.com and salary.com to get a feeling for the overall levels of compensation for your job in your area. I would also go over to http://www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com/how-to-negotiate/ - the guy has a bunch of salary negotiation videos on his blog that you might find helpful. The information above should give you plenty of pointers re negotiating a raise without mentioning the other offer.

Datsun1500 wrote: I have employees, so I will answer this from that angle. If you play games with me and waste my time, you will lose. It is not worth the headache. This means as the guy that is offering the new job, if you do the whole process and use it only to stay at the existing job, you will never get another offer from me. As the existing employer, if you threaten to leave, or actually leave, you will never get another raise from me, and most of the time will be told to go, since you are not happy here. It is about being an adult, and cutting through the BS. If you came to me and said I have another company that wants to offer me a job, it is more money, but I like this job better, we could have a 5 minute conversation and come to an agreement. It might be a raise, benefit, or telling you I can't or won't match the offer, and why. Either way it will be solved in 5 minutes, not days.... and if you keep your current job, let the new guy know you do not want to move at this time. one to one, no BS conversation, results in a resolution that both are happy with, and 95% of the time it is with staying on here. Playing games and trying to manipulate me results in you losing your job every time.

While I agree, it is companies that generally start the game playing. The fact that experience shows that the way to get a raise is to move is sad, but it's reality. I'd LOVE to go to my boss / HR and say "I love it here, but the pay just isn't where it needs to be. I'm tired of being tempted to call back the head hunters, but I'm cheating my family if I am not maximizing my earning potential. Fix the pay and have a happy employee forever." Unfortunately, that's not the way the game is played it seems.

Datsun1500 summarized it nicely.

If you play a game with me, you lose. I am the only one who gets to play the games.

That's how it is. You're underpaid for a reason. You can play the bluff, but you'll probably lose in the long run. If the company was smart enough to realize that you're worth keeping, you'd already be paid accordingly.

I went through this. I left the perfect job in a small shop, with medium/low pay for a dirty, filthy job, where I was just a number, for top rate pay in the industry. That was in 2000 and I would do it again in a heartbeat. I was there for 13 years and had been telling them for the last 3 that I needed more money. There was no bluff. I told them I was leaving and not to try and match it.

But you said you it was the perfect job? Wouldn't it have been more perfect for competitive pay?

Zomby Woof wrote: If the company was smart enough to realize that you're worth keeping, you'd already be paid accordingly.

disagree completely.

You don't get what's deserved in life, it's what's negotiated.