I have a couple of Chinese HF engines that hate the stuff, but my string trimmer and lawnmower don't seem to care. My old E150 ran like crap on it. The Colorado doesn't care. My F350 runs fine but looses about 2 mgp and when you start at 11, that's a lot. The Samurai doesn't care and SanFord doesn't seem to care either but I haven't put enough mileage on it to know for sure.
Knurled wrote: I'm thinking it's a local fuel quality issue. I've never had problems with small engines on Ohio E10. However, my car (tuned open loop only on Ohio E10) runs like garbage on whatever they claim is gasoline in Illinois and Indiana. I will fill my car and a 5gal jerrycan just before leaving Ohio, then make my way across both states before buying any more fuel.
Last I checked Indiana is mostly e15 for regular pump gas at this point....I've seen a few stations with e20. 
Mine did too. But I hit the primer 10 to the third times more than it says on the machine.
It smokes a little...
alfadriver wrote: Funny. My snow blower started on the first try. On the gas I bought last winter.
No ethanol goes into gas cans at my house, and they all get marine sta-bil when I fill them. Too many bad gas issues around here. Sort of the same thing with diesel fuel, if it is going in a can it's going to be #1 diesel I can use year round.
I'll fill anything driving or towed to a gas station with whatever, but if I am hoping for shelf life I am particular.
Well checking pure-gas and buyrealgas shows surprisingly few in the direct Metro Detroit area, but there is one about 10 mins South of work and another on the East side close-ish to the stables my daughter rides at. Either one is a 45-50 min drive from home, but I'll bring a 5 gal race can to work sometime and fill up one lunch time at the place close to work and try that from here on out.
All my cars and power equipment get Costco gas. It's E10, but it's also Top Tier gas. Knock on wood, but I haven't had any problems.
We use Stabil. There isn't an ethanol-free station within a tank's drive of me.
Stabil is alcohol. Well, 95% of it is.
Being that most if it is isopropyl, you can probably use a jar of rubbing alcohol.
Ethanol, Methanol, iso propyl- all of them absorb water and gas. Just allowing two things that don't want to mix to do so... Just like when you use mustard in a vinegar/oil dressing.
Eric, how do different types of alcohol affect things like the plastic of the tank, lines etc?
I've never put much stock in the whole ethanol is the devil debate until two nights ago. Maybe I just have some crappy base gas, but I know lots of people have had genuine issues with ethanol in older vehicles, some with certain types of non metal tanks, planes etc. Does ethanol react differently thank Methanol, from isopopaol from butyl etc.?
alfadriver wrote: Stabil is alcohol. Well, 95% of it is. Being that most if it is isopropyl, you can probably use a jar of rubbing alcohol. Ethanol, Methanol, iso propyl- all of them absorb water and gas. Just allowing two things that don't want to mix to do so... Just like when you use mustard in a vinegar/oil dressing.
From Stabil's web page. Take it with a grain of salt. I have no idea.
Top Five STA-BIL Product Myths Debunked
Here are the top five myths we’ve heard, and how they’re mistaken:
Myth #1: “STA-BIL contains alcohol.”
STA-BIL products—including our fuel stabilizer, ethanol treatment, marine formula and diesel fuel stabilizer—contain proprietary ingredients. While we can’t share the full list (it’s a trade secret), we can tell you that alcohol is NOT one of them.
Our stabilizers and treatments each contain a powerful mix of additives and chemicals that neutralize acids, prevent gasoline from oxidizing and coat metal surfaces to prevent corrosion.
Every product in the STA-BIL brand family performs a different function. Each one is specially formulated to treat a specific type of fuel, from pure gasoline to ethanol blends and every type of engine, from lawnmower to boat to classic car.
I am right there with you. I had an old lawn mower that didn't give a crap about ethanol. I could just leave gas in it without any additives all winter and the thing would fire right up. But it finally was just completely falling apart.
I got a new one and I put STA-BIL in it and the damn thing is still dead.
I question the viability of that ethanol free list.
All Stewarts Shops sell Sunoco with "up to 10%" ethanol.
I buy my gas regularly from my local Stewarts.
Personally I'm not convinced stabil does anything, but my dad likes it. Also, we don't use it in cars. Or maybe he does? Anyway, I don't.
Adrian_Thompson wrote: Eric, how do different types of alcohol affect things like the plastic of the tank, lines etc? I've never put much stock in the whole ethanol is the devil debate until two nights ago. Maybe I just have some crappy base gas, but I know lots of people have had genuine issues with ethanol in older vehicles, some with certain types of non metal tanks, planes etc. Does ethanol react differently thank Methanol, from isopopaol from butyl etc.?
Indeed they do. Not sure the specifics, but like any other hydrocarbon, the reaction depends on what the chemical make up is.
And the background chemicals matter, too- I know there is a big difference between E10 and E85- and not being a chemical engineer, I don't fully understand why E10 has issues that E85 doesn't. Seems like the increased amount of alcohol allows it to absorb a lot more water... dunno.
But, I'm far more in the camp that you need to find a new pump.
In reply to spitfirebill:
Most MSDS's for it I find don't have much on useful info- but one says it is 95% isoparifin. Which says that it's some kind of hydrocarbon that the C's are saturated with H's.
But one of the claims is that it keeps water in the fuel. I'm not aware of any pure hydrocarbon that mixes with water. Add an OH bond, and it all of a sudden mixes with water. Which also makes a garden variety hydrocarbon into alcohol.
Methane is CH4, Methanol is CH4OH.
You can get ethanol free gas at most marine pumps. Ethanol wrecked havoc with fibre glass marine fuel tanks.
It should be noted that it's real easy to test gas for ethanol content before you buy a bunch of it, since you can wash it out with a bit of water in a graduated cylinder (100 ml is a good size, say 30 water 70 fuel) shake it up and look for the separation line. If it moved you've got ethanol, e.g. 7 ml extra "water" gives 7/70=10% ethanol. You can even buy test tubes marked solely for this purpose, but they cost a lot more than a plastic 100ml graduated cylinder and a cork.
Appleseed wrote: You can get ethanol free gas at most marine pumps. Ethanol wrecked havoc with fibre glass marine fuel tanks.
This. If you live anywhere near where people boat, look for stations with "REC90" fuel. It is non-ethanol, and available all over South Florida at regular gas stations in addition to marinas. Its all I buy for the boat or my jerry-can for small engines.
I've never had a problem with Ethanol. If manufacturers are not designing their products for Ethanol fuel, that's a mistake on their part.
If it is something that get stored (lawnmower, outboard, etc.) I make sure that it is completely drained of fuel (including the bulb in the carb) and I fog the cylinders with a bit of oil before it goes into hibernation mode. I also make sure to run them out of gas in between uses. That's easy with my lawnmower (it usually runs out of gas before the entire lawn is done, so I just rotate the 50' of un-mowed part) and my outboard (disconnect the fuel line from the engine and let it run until it stops).
My Honda V-Twin powered Hustler Fastrak does not like ethanol. I really need to replace the carb, but I've been using non-ethanol for several years and it will run okay at full power. Throttle it back and it sputters.
Non-ethanol fuel is available at several locations around here. 87, 90, & 93 octane is available.
I use the 93 non-ethanol in the FX16 because the car sits... a lot.
I find it interesting that in the past we put alcohol (dri-gas) in our tanks to absorb water. Now with ethanol we don't have to bother.
Brett_Murphy wrote: I've never had a problem with Ethanol. If manufacturers are not designing their products for Ethanol fuel, that's a mistake on their part.
Sounds like you don't ride a 35 year old motorcycle.
Adrian, where did this most recent bad gas come from? Mobil, BP, Exxon, and most Shell is supposed to be Ethanol free around here.
Gearheadotaku wrote: Adrian, where did this most recent bad gas come from? Mobil, BP, Exxon, and most Shell is supposed to be Ethanol free around here.
Marathon or BP at 13 and Southfield, I forget which one.
Appleseed wrote: Sounds like you don't ride a 35 year old motorcycle.
No, but I have an old boat. If they are not making replacement parts that can handle ethanol for the old machines, which has been in the gasoline supply for years, they don't want you to drive it any longer. If they are making replacement parts that can handle it (including carbs) there is an option for you.
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