Learn me: 12VDC house wiring

Ian F wrote: That closet lighting looks good Dr.

Thanks. I'm happy with it, and it's spurred my daughter to keep her closet cleaner. That's worth anything!!

Ian F wrote: I was in a client office last week where they had some of those T8 retrofit LEDs. Amazing. Had to really look at them to see it wasn't a fluorescent. Here's an example for $30/bulb: http://www.bulbs.com/espec.aspx?ID=23896&cm_mmc=GooglePLA-_-NonBrand-_-none-_-&AffID=6&device={device}&network={network}&matchtype={matchtype}&gclid=CIDQuZTupL0CFcg7OgodKy4A7w These aren't the ones I saw, which were a different type that replaced the ballast as well and probably cost more.

That $30 price tag isn't that bad. For some reason I think Jay said what he paid was 10X that, but that could have been for all 4 bulbs in a fixture. Its been a while since I saw the episode. I've been interested in LED lighting for years and have been waiting for the prices to come down out of the stratosphere.

I had slowly changed over all the lamps in my rental to LED.. now I get to do it all over again in my Father's new house. They make a big difference. I never really cared for CFLs.. something about them gave me headaches..

In reply to Jcamper:

I understand that lighting isn't a huge part of my load, but I do have several other devices that run on 12VDC, as well, such as my security camera system, and my home network. I have no clue how much transmission losses will come into play, but it seems like I shouldn't have any trouble getting a few amps to each fixture.

Lights that I'm running new wiring for can also have remote switching implemented fairly easily. ROI isn't the reason for a project like this, but eliminating fluorescent flicker is.

As for having 2 switch plates on a wall, who cares? That's no big deal to me.

Where are you located at? Average temps, days of sun, what type of heating do you have in your house? Do you use air conditioning, if so how many days per year? How is the overall insulation in your house (windows, etc.)? How many people? What are your power rates? J

I'm subscribing to this as well.

In addition to a lot of home lighting that could be solar, pretty much all home electronics that don't have an internal power supply could be run off a clean 12v or 5v DC supply... modem, router, phone chargers, my raspberry pi, laptops, etc. 12v input power supplies are available for desktops as well, especially low power/high efficiency builds.

I think it would come in handy during power outages, but saving that $$ off my electric bill every month would be nice as well

Most of the installation will happen during a remodel. Attic insulation is good, but could use some additional air flow. Windows will be replaced with some nice high efficiency ones. 3-5 people, old AC that I'm planning on replacing with a geothermal unit. I live in Florida, so the aircon is on for at least 200 days a year. Heating is all electric space heaters since they see so little use. Current power rates are in the low $0.30 range, but I'm not looking at ROI at all to be truthful. This is just a pet project.

Something to think about...

What do you have that runs directly off of 12V? Outside of stuff specific to a car, I really can't think of anything.

However, I've got a bunch of stuff that run 5V. Here's an idea- instead of worrying about a unique plug, find lights and stuff that runs off of USB outlets- then use THAT as your wall outlet.

I bet you can find LED light fixtures that run a smooth 5V, too.

For storage and generation- 12V makes a lot more sense. Delivery, well, that I would think about. Seems like one 5V conversion is better than a bunch of them scattered around the house.

Derick Freese wrote: Most of the installation will happen during a remodel. Attic insulation is good, but could use some additional air flow. Windows will be replaced with some nice high efficiency ones. 3-5 people, old AC that I'm planning on replacing with a geothermal unit. I live in Florida, so the aircon is on for at least 200 days a year. Heating is all electric space heaters since they see so little use. Current power rates are in the low $0.30 range, but I'm not looking at ROI at all to be truthful. This is just a pet project.

Sounds like you have the right attitude. If you are getting into the walls, I would be tempted to run some conduit for the runs you are looking at; that makes it easy to pull in/out different wires for projects like this.

Not directed at DF, but just to get others thinking that are interested in ROI: think about the total system. For example, if you live in a climate where you use heat most of the year, incandescent bulbs work pretty well for places in the heated part of your home. An incandescent puts out mostly heat (90% of its energy output), since your heat will stay on until a set temperature is achieved inside the house, more "efficient" bulbs simply trade less energy used at that point for a few more seconds of furnace running.

The opposite is true for DF's case, it is a double whammy with AC using incandescent bulbs. I know incandescent bulbs are pretty much gone, but for anybody that hates the light/flicker of CF, something to consider.

I also want to add that the low hanging fruit for ROI is insulation, efficiency, and in most cases a solar hot water system. This is especially true where I am at in the northwest since our heaviest power usage comes during months where there is very little available insolation.

DF, how much power does your network and security system consume? I wouldn't bother running low voltage DC for anything other than extremely low power devices. Ohm's law and all that. J

All of my network devices use a 1A 12VDC plug pack. While I haven't measured the current draw on any of them, I'm sure it's rather less than that. If I do power my network with this system, it would be relocated to closer to the source of power to reduce transmission loss, since it's something that's trivial to move.

This seems like an interesting device. Why not go right for LiIon batteries?

DC or less things I can think of in my house:

5V:
2x iPhones
2x PS3 Controllers
1x Raspberry Pi (webserver)

12-24v:
1 desktop 2 laptops Some speakers

1 PS3
1 TV

1 Charger for 18V Dewalt-Drill 2 Chargers for 32V (?) Weed Trimmer & Leaf Blower

Unfortunately, the PS3 and the TV have internal power supplies, so getting a DC supply to them would be worthless. I'd keep an inverter around to run them when power is out... but its an unfortunate waste to go 24VDC -> 110AC -> 12V DC. Same is probably true for the chargers.

This site has some helpful goodies: http://www.miniinthebox.com/3-5-30v-to-4-0-30v-dc-dc-booster-converter-step-up-voltage-regulator-lm2587_p391026.html?currency=USD&litb_from=paid_adwords_shopping&pla_adwid=9286587055_138822303_9138328623_60167196903&gclid=CLnao52o-boCFShk7Aod9DsAGw it would only take a couple of parts to supply power to all of my DC electronics. Luckily, most of the things listed above are already powered from the same spot in the house, meaning only 1 wire drop is really needed for that stuff.

The system seems marginally worth doing for only DC electronics... but add in some LED lighting and some occasional stuff run off an inverter and its pretty enticing.

Now if only I could move to an electric car, electric lawn mower, etc...

I'm more interested in a serial hybrid lawn tractor than full electric. Let it be your standby generator!

Derick Freese wrote: I'm more interested in a serial hybrid lawn tractor than full electric. Let it be your standby generator!

If they ever can get it right, that Raven riding mower/generator/atv thing is almost interesting.

I've never used one, but a LM317 can be used for voltage regulating down from 12v down to 5v. It looks like you can get them for $.50 - $.60 a piece.