Learn me adoption

Did I really just post this on GRM?

I don't post often but visit here and read post daily. I realize this is an odd topic for a car forum but this is the only forum where I really care what people have to say.

My wife and I, her being 38 and I being 36 have finally come to terms with the fact that we are not able to get pregnant and that we are interested in learning more about adoption and the different options available to us.

That being said I ask those who have adopted or know someone who has to share their knowledge and their stories with me in this thread.

My wife and I have heard a few bits and pieces here and there but what I'm really looking for is the "real life" point of view on adoption not some fancy website or flyer.

Thanks Dan

We have a 19 year old the "standard" way and then adopted a girl later in life.

You will need to figure which way you want to go - domestic or overseas. Then find an adoption agency that you can work with. They will help with costs and options with all the different countries. I am willing to talk off forum or even on the phone. There is a $10k tax credit that helped a lot.

I can also help with the info on the background checks. The process took a while but was totally worth the time and effort!

It's a very very stressful experience, but completely worth it in the end.

My take on the various types from personal experience and family and friends experiences:

International: guaranteed to be expensive, can sometimes be unpredictable, but you don't ever have any birth mother medical expenses or unpredictability with gaining custody. The child is pretty much guaranteed to not look like you if you are not adopting from a country of your ancestors, so you have to decide if that bothers you. A nice part about that is the timing of the adoption talk with your child will be decided for you because one day they will ask. You never have to worry about a birth parent randomly showing up, but your child never can satisfy that urge to meet the biological parents later in life. You can rarely adopt a newborn and you know it was very likely that your child was in a poor orphanage or foster home before they were placed in your home.

Foster care: Very noble but probably the most painful of all the processes. The foster care agencies are overworked and underfunded. Combine that with the fact that keeping families together is their number 1 priority, you get abused. They will lie to you repeatedly with promises after promise of this child being the one that will end up staying in your home only to have it taken from you and given back to the mother that broke its arm, rubbed feces in its face, and has a documented drug habit. What I have noticed with families that adopt through foster care is that after having 2-4 infants placed and removed from their homes they loosen their requirements and adopt an older child. Then after adopting the older child they often continue as a foster family until they get at least one infant. The people who foster are incredible and we desperately need them, but be aware of what you are in for.

Domestic through an agency: Very expensive but more straightforward than many of the other domestic options. An agency advertises, has contacts throughout the legal community, etc... You give them lots of money, and they find you a baby. They handle the birth mother, all the legal stuff, all the medical out of their fees, arranging your homestudy, etc... You do your part by giving them large sums of money

Domestic through an Attorney: (our method): Expenses vary, but typically they are cheaper than agency adoptions and can even be less than the tax credit. You find an attorney who specializes in adoptions, they present you with a file on a birthmother. You decide whether she gets to see your portfolio, and if she likes it she chooses you. You may end up paying room and board, medical, etc... The types of adoptions are wide open in this scenario. If they are more difficult, the attorney works more hours and you pay more. The ease of the adoption varies greatly with the quality of your attorney.

Domestic through your own ingenuity: With the advent of the internet, there are many options for marketing yourself. There are websites galore, web pages, etc... In the end, you still have to use an attorney. If you like marketing, this method is worth a try.

When asked about who gives up babies for adoptions, my attorney said this: In her experience, Educated whites have abortions, Asian girls don't get pregnant, Black families keep the baby and Grandma or another relative raises is, Hispanics often raise it themselves or with family, and poor country white girls have it and give it up for adoption. That statement is full of stereotypes, but in my attorneys experience, most of the babies available for non foster adoption from around North Central Florida are Caucasian. Don't know and don't care if that matters to you or anyone else.

The tax credit is awesome. I think it is up to $11,500 per child. That is a tax credit, not deduction. The credit is up to the amount you spent on the adoption, up to $11,500. They even changed it this year so that you get the entire amount on your refund even if you didn't pay that much in taxes the last year. The credit is granted once the adoption is legally finalized. That said, the financial side of foster care is wonderful. You don't have to pay for an attorney, you get money for daycare, and I think you even get money for college.

Little things:
-you think they have all your good and bad traits just like you do if they are genetically yours-you just think they learned them instead of being born with them.

-You will be Mommy and Daddy to the child really really quickly, it's amazing how quickly that happens.

-Children seem less stressed about switching than the parents.

-They become "yours" immediately-everyone else watch out because your wife is suddenly a momma bear.

-Everyone expects adopting families to adopt the exceptionally needy children. You may not want to, but they all think you should.

-Be prepared to be given as much weird advice on this topic as you I'm sure have been about getting pregnant.

-Everyone has a relative who might give up the kid-most don't actually give it up.

BTW-the homestudy people may scare you, but they actually work for you. They want you to pass. If you have half a brain and clean your house before they show up you will be fine. Even if they think you should do something differently they will use the homestudy as a chance to teach you how to do it right.

Foreign adoptions were rare when my wife and I had this discussion and I had issues with the domestic process. In fact I had been involved in setting aside a adoption arranged by DCS and there had been substantial fraud and document alteration in the process. We finally decided to forego the plan. YMMV

I don't have any advice to give but I did want to say that anyone who adopts deserves at least one free beer. It takes a lot to do that and my hat is off to you.

We are currently fostering with the goal of adoption through one of the local county children's services. Going through their program of training, fostering and adopting the adoption will only cost $300-500 - just some court fees and such. This varies by state and county I'm sure. You don't have to foster to adopt but if a child becomes available for adoption while in foster care, the foster parents get "first dibs" if you will.

Like I said, we're doing it right now and have a 2-y.o. and a 9-m.o. brother-sister pair but unfortunately it doesn't appear they will be available for adoption. That's the downside of going thru public services, they give the parents soooo many chances and cut them so much slack its sad really when thinking that the kids have to go back into a situation that isn't going to be good. And the flip side is that foster/adoptive parents have to go thru 36-hours of training, extensive background checks, credit checks, etc. but the parents don't have to jack to get their kids back (unless the court orders some education classes or something). Going thru the training and initial process, you feel like you're the "bad parent" because of the detail and basic invasion of privacy you go thru.

EDIT - MrJosh hit it pretty good above - guess I should have read before posting!

But like said above, it's worth it and we haven't even adopted yet.

A beer to you fastEddie. We desperately need more foster families. Do you have the option of, and are you planning on being involved in the kids lives if they go back to the biological mother?

I don't think we'll have the option and even if we did I don't think she'd go for it. Too bad, the 2-y.o. is already calling us Mommy and Daddy on his own accord (from hearing our older biological spawn say it ) and has from day 1 with us referred to his biological mom by her first name....

We're actually facing the strong likelyhood that they will take the 2-y.o. away from us and his sister here shortly as his paternal grandmother has expressed interest in custody of him but not his sister (different fathers). It boggles my mind that they would split them up - even at their ages they definitely have a bond and love to play with each other. Now I'm getting pissed just thinking about it. Sorry.

Everyone has already said what I was going to say,

I have adopted a baby girl (10 months old) in China in 2006. http://dori-love.blogspot.com She is now 4 years old and will be 5 in December.

I also have two birth children, boys, 17 and 12.

If pete240Z or Mr. Joshua can not answer your questions then hit me up.

Oh, she is just beautiful!!

In reply to EricM:

My Sister has a 5yo girl from China and we signed up right as China slowed to basically a stop. We are still on the list and debating if we want to drop our after our domestic sibling pair adoption. Congratulations on your beautiful girl.

thanks! and Thanks!

Wow, excellent post MrJoshua. I can only add some 'thoughts for the future' being an adoptee.

At some point, the kidlet WILL ask about being adopted. Maybe not so much if they look similar to you but we're not dumb and we figure out something ain't quite right. It's much better to explain it when they are young; I think I was around 5 when I got the talk and my reaction was "Oh, okay". Since Mommy and Daddy are the people who raised me it didn't mean much.

When we do ask for details, or (gasp!) to find our birth parent(s) do not take it as an affront that you're bad parents. At some point most adoptees realize there is something missing from their history. You can only look into the mirror and realize you look like nobody else you know so many times before it starts to tug at you. Some folks react more strongly to the pull for historical fulfillment than others. Girls tend to want to search earlier and with more vigor than males. Don't let it bug you. If you're not an adoptee, you can't understand that empty space. If you can help them fill it, you'll be a hero. You won't be replaced. I kind of feel for the foreign adoptees who will have really no chance of filling that little black hole.

That said, I don't believe in "open" adoption. I think it's a very bad idea. I'm cool with the concept of the parents keeping in touch with the birth mother and sending pictures or letters through the years, but visitation is, in my opinion, adding some really scary confusion to the kid's life. I would not have wanted that. Once they turn 18 (or better yet, older) then sure, we can meet, but not before.

These are just things you should also think about if you're pondering the adoption option. Understand that we WILL ask questions and it's not a desire for us to have different parents. It's just fulfilling to know where we got that large forehead or lousy eyesight from. You handle it right, and it can actually bring everyone closer together.

ddavidv wrote: When we do ask for details, or (gasp!) to find our birth parent(s) do not take it as an affront that you're bad parents. At some point most adoptees realize there is something missing from their history. You can only look into the mirror and realize you look like nobody else you know so many times before it starts to tug at you. Some folks react more strongly to the pull for historical fulfillment than others. Girls tend to want to search earlier and with more vigor than males. Don't let it bug you.

Quoted because it's very important - my wife was adopted (as are all her siblings) and they were actively discouraged to go and find out who their birth parents were. I think my wife is the only one who has met them and actually still has contact with her birth mother now. It was important to her and it did cause upset with her parents because they didn't quite understand why she needed to do that.

I - while not being adopted - only met my biological father and his family when I was in my late 20s. I still have lose contact with them and I think it's important to know that part of your history; it doesn't change who your 'real' parents are (even thought I gained a cool half-sister in the process).

Thank you all so much for sharing your stories and experiences with adoption. Though it is still early my wife and I are wanting a domestic adoption of an infant. I guess we'll have to figure our attorney or agency.

My hat goes off to those doing the foster care. I know the adoption process is going to be a roller coaster ride but I can't imagine building a bond with a child and having someone take them away only to give them back to E36 M3ty parents.

My boss did an open adoption with his two children and he has positive things to say about it but I can't help but think of the confusion and hurt not to mention drama your leaving yourself open to. My neighbors just adopted a little boy from Arkansas. They did a closed adoption. My wife are going to take them out for diner one night and pick their brain on the subject.

I'm going to show my with this thread tonight so please keep sharing. For those who offered to speak to me off line I do appreciate that and will be contacting you soon.

Thanks dan

ddavidv wrote: Wow, excellent post MrJoshua. I can only add some 'thoughts for the future' being an adoptee. At some point, the kidlet WILL ask about being adopted. Maybe not so much if they look similar to you but we're not dumb and we figure out something ain't quite right. It's much better to explain it when they are young; I think I was around 5 when I got the talk and my reaction was "Oh, okay". Since Mommy and Daddy are the people who raised me it didn't mean much. When we do ask for details, or (gasp!) to find our birth parent(s) do not take it as an affront that you're bad parents. At some point most adoptees realize there is something missing from their history. You can only look into the mirror and realize you look like nobody else you know so many times before it starts to tug at you. Some folks react more strongly to the pull for historical fulfillment than others. Girls tend to want to search earlier and with more vigor than males. Don't let it bug you. If you're not an adoptee, you can't understand that empty space. If you can help them fill it, you'll be a hero. You won't be replaced. I kind of feel for the foreign adoptees who will have really no chance of filling that little black hole. That said, I don't believe in "open" adoption. I think it's a very bad idea. I'm cool with the concept of the parents keeping in touch with the birth mother and sending pictures or letters through the years, but visitation is, in my opinion, adding some really scary confusion to the kid's life. I would not have wanted that. Once they turn 18 (or better yet, older) then sure, we can meet, but not before. These are just things you should also think about if you're pondering the adoption option. Understand that we WILL ask questions and it's not a desire for us to have different parents. It's just fulfilling to know where we got that large forehead or lousy eyesight from. You handle it right, and it can actually bring everyone closer together.

Very well said, as a person who was adopted at birth, I agree wholeheartedly.

My cousin adopted a three year old boy, who showed signs of abuse. He has had trouble with drugs/alcohol and emotional issues. (In his twenties) It's not always rainbows and unicorns. But imagine what it would be like growing up in 'the system", all adoptees do, and are VERY grateful someone took a chance.

Hey everyone, Thought I would bring this back from the dead. Unfortunately my wife and I have yet to adopt. We've had trouble saving the money needed and just haven't pulled the trigger on taking the steps to do so. I have though put my food truck up for sale in a hopes to get the money needed for us to get serious. My wife and I aren't getting any younger and I wish very much to be able to adopt this year. Thanks again and if anyone that has experience with a domestic adoption in or around Ohio is out there please chime in.

Thanks Dan

Thank you for bringing this back to the top. My wife and i are seriously considering adopting.
Bookmarked.

I want to point this out again because it was so amazing to me when we adopted that I almost didn't believe it: There is a Federal Tax Credit on adoptions of over $11,000 dollars per adopted child. That is a CREDIT not deduction. That means if you owed $11,000 in taxes the year your adoption was completed and you spent over $11,000 on your adoption you would owe $0 in taxes that year. You would then get whatever was taken out of your checks that year in taxes sent to you by the IRS. It used to be you could only get a credit up to the amount you owed and the excess carried over to the next years taxes. That was changed during the last few years so you now get the full amount of the credit no matter what you owe.
The reason I point this out is it means you don't need money ahead, you need credit. Float the amount for the year or two it takes you to adopt and get all or most of it back at tax time. If you are willing to finance a car, you should have no problem financing the adoption of a child.

This //\.

I use an accountant and then ballpark my taxes. Not knowing all the tax laws I figure I'm getting $700 back.

She sends my tax info back stating I'm getting $7,000+ back that year.......(me on the phone; yeah, I believe there is an error.....).

Nope. Got back a smaller portion the next year.

In reply to MrJoshua:
I had no idea!!!!!!!
This may very well speed the process.

To you folks who adopt: You all get free beer and huge points as a great human being in my book.

I've got an adopted cousin and another cousin who has adopted a kid of her own. They're both great and more a part of the family than some of our family members.

There's lots of great kids out there who need a loving home.

Shawn

Just an update on our situation -

After 20 months of having our two little ones, they were taken from us just over a month ago to live with their maternal grandmother. It doesn't matter how much you know it's coming it doesn't make it any easier....

Before they left though we also were able to bring a 15 yo boy into our lives who was already on PC (permanent custody) status with the county. He's been here almost 3 months now and has quickly become part of the family and we're looking forward to the 6-month mark when we can adopt him.

On the topic of adoption, the state or county provides ~$1,000 of adoption cost subsidy and there are more than a couple of lawyers who will do everything for whatever the subsidy amount is so you won't be out of pocket anything. Some require a retainer that they refund upon receipt of the public funds but others, like ours, don't even require that.

If I didn't state before, we're going through Montgomery County Dept. of Jobs and Family Services here in Ohio.

In reply to EricM:

OMG what a cute little kid (and I'm not a fan of kids )

Best wishes/good luck to all in this thread.

If you do adopt make sure there is an easy way for the kid to find his/her birth parents. It has been a long and expensive road for me to find mine. All I want is a family medical history, something very important to have in this day in age.