Microsoft XP

foxtrapper wrote: I think you'd be surprised at how many old car parts you actually can get from a dealer. Which is actually beside the point of your rant against people running old things when new things are better. Sometimes people like something. Be it an old car, an old computer, or a particular flavor of ice cream. If that's what a person likes, so be it. It doesn't harm you at all. No reason to get so upset over it.

I think he got his period.

foxtrapper wrote: It doesn't harm you at all. No reason to get so upset over it.

Come do my job for a week and see if you feel the same way. On a daily basis I waste hours trying to explain why peoples 10 year old computer is slower than the new one at their office or why it it can't run certain software because it it doesn't meet system requirements. And then they start to argue with me saying their computer isn't that old.

Dr. Hess wrote: Just install good anti-virus software, like Avast and don't worry about it.

This. The CEO of Avast has said that they will provide support for XP for at least the next three years. Put Avast on the machine and don't worry about it. When you replace the computer the problem will take care of its self.

spitfirebill wrote: So what do I do now? Old cast off computer from work that is just fine for me to diddle around on has Windows XP. Am I pretty much screwed? Maybe Obama can sign an Executive order tonight and force Microsoft to keep supporting it. The news tonight said more than 80% of all businesses and ATMs still use it. It's for national security.

I disable automatic updates on everything I own. So everything I have has been "unsupported" since day one.

B.F.D.

rebelgtp wrote:

foxtrapper wrote: It doesn't harm you at all. No reason to get so upset over it.

Come do my job for a week and see if you feel the same way. On a daily basis I waste hours trying to explain why peoples 10 year old computer is slower than the new one at their office or why it it can't run certain software because it it doesn't meet system requirements. And then they start to argue with me saying their computer isn't that old.

What you deal with isn't unique. I deal with it constantly in my job, as do most of us in life. Sometimes I receive it from customers, sometimes I'm the customer.

No reason to get upset. In no small measure, it's why you have a job.

Rusted_Busted_Spit wrote:

Dr. Hess wrote: Just install good anti-virus software, like Avast and don't worry about it.

This. The CEO of Avast has said that they will provide support for XP for at least the next three years. Put Avast on the machine and don't worry about it. When you replace the computer the problem will take care of its self.

It's already on there.

Thanks

wbjones wrote:

Keith Tanner wrote: I predict a rise in aggressive anti-virus ads and a spike in the number of botnets. Spent this week setting my dad up on his new iMac. He feels betrayed by Microsoft.

same thing will happen with the Mac … (disclaimer: I have used Mac OS X for ~ 10 yrs now … started with Tiger) had to buy a new MacMini this past yr because Tiger had been upgraded as much as it could be and some of the things wouldn't run anymore (iTunes for one)

News flash: computers become obsolete I completely understand why people keep using the same ones if their needs don't change. My parents use their computer for email, word processing and web surfing. The XP box did that just fine, at least when it wasn't having trouble with a virus. We're talking about people who have used computers as tools for years, but who are not computer people. They don't want to spend time working on it, they just want it to do stuff. If it was a car, it would be an Accord.

I think OSX is inherently more secure. I'm not sure Avast (which I use on my own personal PCs) is going to be able to deal with the as-yet-undiscovered exploits against XP, some of them may require patching the OS. So there is definitely a potential problem with all those XP boxes out there that will no longer be updated. Remember the problems with people who didn't keep their OS patched and up to date? Well, that's going to be all the XP machines now.

As for me, I wanted my parents on OSX because I live two thousand miles away and I'd rather support OSX. I love Time Machine (my dad seems to lose one hard drive every three years or so) and it's really solid hardware.

For those who haven't used a Windows machine since XP, you'd have no trouble adapting to Win8. Once you get past the Fisher Price main screen, it's all familiar. Same with 7, same with Vista.

How well does Win7/Win8 deal with DOS programs?

Not that XP does it much better, mind you, which is why you have to have a computer that runs DOS. Because sometimes there are programs you need to run that have never been ported to newer OSs.

The OS is a component. If it ain't broke, why worry about it? Sure, Microsoft isn't issuing updates anymore. GM isn't issuing updated flashes for '97 Corvettes, either. That doesn't mean you have to throw away the computer in your C5 and put a new system in it.

Depends how old they are, you might want to look into this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOSBox

I switched to Win 7 (which has a end of life in 2020) and once in 'classic theme' is fairly close to XP. I upgraded mainly out of concern for security and being able to use new programs in the future. It took me many years to get comfortable with XP and I'm not looking foward to starting over. I find computers difficult to use beyond very basic functions and XP was doing everything I needed. It sucks being stupid, but what are you gonna do?

Knurled wrote: The OS is a component. If it ain't broke, why worry about it? Sure, Microsoft isn't issuing updates anymore. GM isn't issuing updated flashes for '97 Corvettes, either. That doesn't mean you have to throw away the computer in your C5 and put a new system in it.

Because you don't have people constantly trying to improve their attacks on the 1997 Corvette computer. Every day, there are more security vulnerabilities found in the OS, and that's not going to change. What's going to change is that those vulnerabilities will no longer be fixed. That's an issue.

How many people are trying to figure out the vulnerabilities in Win98?

You are trying to think like a rational person. Some 12-30 year old "kid" trying to break an OS isn't exactly that. Or at the very least, suffers an obsession like some people who try to make K-cars go 11 seconds in the 1/4 mile :P

Its a challenge... and one you can make money at (legal or illegal). So yea, there are probably a couple thousand people at any time still trying to break Windows 98 somewhere in the world. Of course, if they were smart, they would be going after whatever system has the largest installed base. Again, see K-car reference, not everyone is "smart" (I keed, having owned a turbo dodge myself) ;)

Knurled wrote: How well does Win7/Win8 deal with DOS programs?

Biggest problem I usually have running an old program is processor speed. This is almost invariably a game issue, not a problem with the likes of a word processing program.

More problematic in my experience is hardware compatability for old programs. Scanners and printers are the most problematic, especially if they are wirelessly connected. The old program and new scanner don't recognize one another, and trying to figure out ways to make them talk and work together can be tedious at times.

Knurled wrote: How well does Win7/Win8 deal with DOS programs? Not that XP does it much better, mind you, which is why you have to have a computer that runs DOS. Because sometimes there are programs you need to run that have never been ported to newer OSs. The OS is a component. If it ain't broke, why worry about it? Sure, Microsoft isn't issuing updates anymore. GM isn't issuing updated flashes for '97 Corvettes, either. That doesn't mean you have to throw away the computer in your C5 and put a new system in it.

but your computer in your C5 isn't connected to the internet, where hackers, spammers, etc .. will get into it and cause havoc

Unplug the power, pace back and forth, go in the fetal position.

It is one of the most easily exploitable operating systems out there. Extremely vulnerable to all kinds of attacks. With that being said a good antivirus isn't going to be enough. You'll need a good firewall on your router with some very fine tuned rules and exceptions, an antivirus that is up-to-date and preferably American in nature (don't go buy Kapersky unless you want threats to have an easy back door into your pc/network). The list can go on.

Honestly it's easier to just get a copy of Win7, make sure it's up to date, load an all encompassing pc security program that's more than just AV (Symantec Endpoint or McAfee Internet Security), and boom you're way safer than even the most bolstered XP system out there (aside from those unplugged from the internet and collecting dust).

Knurled wrote:

spitfirebill wrote: So what do I do now? Old cast off computer from work that is just fine for me to diddle around on has Windows XP. Am I pretty much screwed? Maybe Obama can sign an Executive order tonight and force Microsoft to keep supporting it. The news tonight said more than 80% of all businesses and ATMs still use it. It's for national security.

I disable automatic updates on everything I own. So everything I have has been "unsupported" since day one. B.F.D.

Same here. Until last summer I was running the same copy of Windows XP Pirate Version from probably 2001 or so that someone else gave me. Don't do dumb things, keep a good antivirus going, never had an issue. But I finally decided to upgrade for better video editing so I bought a new box last year with Win7 on it. So far so good.

To those of you interested in running DOS programs on modern hardware--as mentioned above, DOSBox is a marvel. Available in Windows and Linux versions (heck, maybe even for Macs, but who cares?) it is extremely configurable if you can do a little tinkering in the config file. I'm running it under Ubuntu and it has no trouble running old games like Warcraft I and II, Descent, Duke Nukem 3D and the like. It even supports IPX/SPX networking. Best of all, it's free and very well documented.

The problem quite frankly, is my dad. And anyone else over 70 that has to use a computer. Every time something changes, he is completely lost. Old people don't get the concept of using a computer, they only memorize exact steps. (usually written on a post-it note beside the PC)

^This is me. And I'm not having a great week, computer wise...

*Please replace "70" with "40".

pinchvalve wrote: The problem quite frankly, is my dad. And anyone else over 70 that has to use a computer. Every time something changes, he is completely lost. Old people don't get the concept of using a computer, they only memorize exact steps. (usually written on a post-it note beside the PC)

I've had this problem since I got my first computer … at mid 30's

Does anyone make/offer an 'idiot-proof' XP emulator for Win7? Something stupid-easy like, "run this program and then open and use your old, but still beloved XP program" easy.

I have an old XP program I used for work I really miss having.

Knurled wrote: How well does Win7/Win8 deal with DOS programs?

Not well; you'll probably be running the 64-bit OS and it has no provisions for running 16-bit programs. You'll need something like DOSbox.

For XP programs you'll probably need a virtual machine running XP. I ended up with that on a work computer for our multi-tens-of-thousands-of-dollars access control system. The "new" software is still 16 bit so won't run under Win7 64-bit. That was $670 in software. Wonderful.

Right click on the application, choose troubleshoot compatibility, answer the questions.

If that fails, install virtualbox, build VM with the OS required for your application and then install the application and run it from within the VM session.