Pakistan did WHAT!!!!

http://www.ocala.com/article/20110615/ZNYT03/106153006/-1/news?Title=Pakistan-Arrests-C-I-A-Informants-in-Bin-Laden-Raid

Pakistan Arrests C.I.A. Informants in Bin Laden Raid ERIC SCHMITT and MARK MAZZETTI Published: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 at 6:30 a.m. Last Modified: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 at 5:16 a.m. WASHINGTON — Pakistan’s top military spy agency has arrested some of the Pakistani informants who fed information to the Central Intelligence Agency in the months leading up to the raid that led to the death of Osama bin Laden, according to American officials. Pakistan’s detention of five C.I.A. informants, including a Pakistani Army major who officials said copied the license plates of cars visiting Bin Laden’s compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan, in the weeks before the raid, is the latest evidence of the fractured relationship between the United States and Pakistan. It comes at a time when the Obama administration is seeking Pakistan’s support in brokering an endgame in the war in neighboring Afghanistan. At a closed briefing last week, members of the Senate Intelligence Committee asked Michael J. Morell, the deputy C.I.A. director, to rate Pakistan’s cooperation with the United States on counterterrorism operations, on a scale of 1 to 10. “Three,” Mr. Morell replied, according to officials familiar with the exchange. The fate of the C.I.A. informants arrested in Pakistan is unclear, but American officials said that the C.I.A. director, Leon E. Panetta, raised the issue when he travelled to Islamabad last week to meet with Pakistani military and intelligence officers.

Is anybody getting the urge to turn sand into glass?

JoeyM wrote: sand into glass?

I've had that urge since the first gulf war.

Getting?

Because the U.S. gov't would never dream of arresting any Pakistani informants who happened to be operating on your soil... right?

At this point it's looking quite obvious that Pakistan values it's relationship with terrorist elements more than it's relationship with the U.S. Think we'll see more weapon sales to India now?

Jay wrote: Because the U.S. gov't would never dream of arresting any Pakistani informants who happened to be operating on your soil... right?

That's true, but we have to watch out for our own best interests. It's also probably in Pakistan's best interests to cooperate with us a little bit better than they have been.

Jay wrote: Because the U.S. gov't would never dream of arresting any Pakistani informants who happened to be operating on your soil... right?

If the Pakistani informants are informing someone on the actions of the United States, you better bet your ass they would be arrested. If the informants are informing our CIA of the happenings around the Bin Laden compound, what are they doing that is against the Pakistani government who had us in their best interest as they so diligently looked for the prime enemy of freedom. Sounds like they have other interest and may not be the allies they were portraying.

It certainly does seem that way

No freaking way Bin Laden lived that close to a military academy and the Pakistani government didn't know about it. I think the only reason we're still pretending they're an ally is because we're still active in Afghanistan and Iraq. Not saying we need to take up military action, just that the pretense would be dropped otherwise.

A citizen of a sovereign nation is informing the agency of a foreign government of activities in said sovereign nation. He is a spy, and should be arrested.

The fact that he did the right thing (in our eyes) is moot.

Streetwiseguy wrote: A citizen of a sovereign nation is informing the agency of a foreign government of activities in said sovereign nation. He is a spy, and should be arrested. The fact that he did the right thing (in our eyes) is moot.

you're assuming they knew they were supplying information to the US/CIA. I doubt some clown in a suit and sunglasses came up to them, announced they were CIA and paid them five grand to give them the information.

Xceler8x wrote: At this point it's looking quite obvious that Pakistan values it's relationship with terrorist elements more than it's relationship with the U.S. Think we'll see more weapon sales to India now?

Ahemm.....

http://www.reuters.com/article/2009/03/16/us-india-usa-arms-idUSTRE52F6X520090316

Streetwiseguy wrote: A citizen of a sovereign nation is informing the agency of a foreign government of activities in said sovereign nation. He is a spy, and should be arrested. The fact that he did the right thing (in our eyes) is moot.

This^

You can be damn sure that the CIA knew this was a possibility for the informants, and if the informants themselves didn't realize it then I thank them for their ignorance.

Or try it this way- an American Army Major is discovered to be an informant for a foreign government—even one of our Allies, like say Israel or Turkey—and I'll bet that dude gets arrested in a hurry.

If the CIA didn't want that to happen (or consider it an allowable bit of after-action fallout) they should have extracted their source.

Tom Heath wrote: Or try it this way- an American Army Major is discovered to be an informant for a foreign government—even one of our Allies, like say Israel or Turkey—and I'll bet that dude gets arrested in a hurry.

Yep.

Also, Pakistan has to play both sides in order to keep some level of peace on their own soil. They had to do something in order to appease the conservatives within their own populace.

It would not surpise me if a big stink is made (mainly over there) and they are detained for awhile until it all blows over... after which they are quietly sent off to some other country (maybe the U.S.) to live happily ever after. If we want/need inside informants to continue to help us, it's in our best interest to not entirely hang them out to dry if something like this happens.

Tom Heath wrote: didn't want that to happen (or consider it an allowable bit of after-action fallout) they should have extracted their source.

That's What She Said! (tm)

Streetwiseguy wrote: A citizen of a sovereign nation is informing the agency of a foreign government of activities in said sovereign nation. He is a spy, and should be arrested. The fact that he did the right thing (in our eyes) is moot.

This. Spies are spies in the eyes of the law.

Tom Heath wrote: Or try it this way- an American Army Major is discovered to be an informant for a foreign government—even one of our Allies, like say Israel or Turkey—and I'll bet that dude gets arrested in a hurry. If the CIA didn't want that to happen (or consider it an allowable bit of after-action fallout) they should have extracted their source.

It's happened several times, actually.

I guess the thing is, the Pakistani's have no reason to have spies in the US to support the US' mission to be a sovereign, peaceful nation. The US has those spies there to help Pakistan, not hurt it.

914Driver wrote:

Xceler8x wrote: At this point it's looking quite obvious that Pakistan values it's relationship with terrorist elements more than it's relationship with the U.S. Think we'll see more weapon sales to India now?

Ahemm..... http://www.reuters.com/article/2009/03/16/us-india-usa-arms-idUSTRE52F6X520090316

Looks like I'm late to the party!

How is recording license plates at a potential terrorist hide out counter productive to government? The guy was a spy, but spying on a potential terrorist. He wasn't reporting military movements of the country he was residing in...or was he?

We've arrested Israeli spies, before. They stay in prison.

HiTempguy wrote: I guess the thing is, the Pakistani's have no reason to have spies in the US to support the US' mission to be a sovereign, peaceful nation. The US has those spies there to help itself, not hurt it.

Fixed that for you. Everything we do as a country is in our own best interest.

stroker wrote:

Streetwiseguy wrote: A citizen of a sovereign nation is informing the agency of a foreign government of activities in said sovereign nation. He is a spy, and should be arrested. The fact that he did the right thing (in our eyes) is moot.

you're assuming they knew they were supplying information to the US/CIA. I doubt some clown in a suit and sunglasses came up to them, announced they were CIA and paid them five grand to give them the information.

Depending on how Pakistani law is worded, it might also require the informants to know the information they were passing on was actually secret. If someone from, say, the UK approached me and said, "I think something is going down in the building across from where you work - could you write down a list of license plates of all the cars parked there for a week?" and offers me money for it, that wouldn't be selling secret information to a foreign national - it would be selling public information to a foreign national, which AFAIK is not a crime.

HiTempguy wrote: I guess the thing is, the Pakistani's have no reason to have spies in the US to support the US' mission to be a sovereign, peaceful nation. The US has those spies there to help Pakistan, not hurt it.

That depends on your point of view... there are plenty of powerful factions in Pakistan that would be happy to see their govt act more like Iran with regards to U.S. relations. Their govt has to do just enough to keep them to the sidelines while keeping the generally more moderate public believing that peaceful relations with the U.S. is better for them... If they fail, the radical factions could gain power and we really could have a nuclear armed Iran on our hands... I have no doubt the entire plot - back to the OBL killing and beyond - is a carefully orchestrated political dance. It should make for an interesting history book in a couple of hundred years (hopefully less).