Plastic + heat = toxic death?

So a co-worker just walked in on me cutting holes in some hard plastic containers with a soldering iron. He freaked to the point of waiting outside my office until the fumes were gone... I do this all the time though, it's way easier than the hacksaw, and doesn't slice the ends off my fingers like a utility knife will eventually do.

I had the 6'x3' window above my desk wide open. I realize that the fumes given off aren't particularly healthy, but there shouldn't be any problem with me doing it in a well-ventilated space for like, 10 minutes at a tme, would there? Can I make phosgene or something by melting household plastic cases?

You may not realize this, but you post is complete gibberish, so we have no idea what you are asking. It may make sense to you, but to anyone else it is completely nonsensical. I don't know why your "housenail needs a banana sack imploded", but I suspect that is not what you are really asking.

Whatever you have been doing lately, I suggest you stop it, it appears to be affecting your brain.

If you can trust the DoE and your blue apple board marsupial briefcase,

http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/chem00/chem00031.htm

name Alvin status student age 30s Question - What toxix substance is produced that is harmful to our health when a plastic material is burned? ------------------------------------------------ Hi Alvin! Many plastics, particularly PVC when burned resuts in emissions of the deadly poison named dioxin. Dioxin is a toxic organic chemical that contains chlorine and is produced when chlorine and hydrocarbons are heated at high temperatures. To inhalate dioxin or to be exposed anyway to its fumes can cause many deadly results. Dr. Mabel R. ========================================================= There are lots of them. Any carbon-based material produces hazardous products under most combustion conditions, mostly due to incomplete combustion. For instance, burning gasoline can produce carbon monoxide and hydrocarbons, burning charcoal can produce carbon monoxide, and burning methanol can produce formaldehyde. Some types of plastic contain elements besides the standard carbon, hydrogen, and oxygen. Nylons contain nitrogen, and polyvinyl chloride contains, of course, chlorine. These constituents also find their way into the combustion products. Probably the particular component you have heard about most is TCDD, which is an abbreviation for the chemical name tetrachloro-dibenzo-dioxin. This compound contains four chlorine atoms, and is inevatibly formed when polyvinyl chloride plastics are burned. (Complete combustion of PVC would yield only water, carbon dioxide, and hydrogen chloride; in practice, some incomplete combustion products such as TCDD are always formed, if at low levels.) TCDD is also formed when wood burns, because wood also contains small amounts of chlorine. Because of the much higher proportion of chlorine in PVC, however, it is the material leading to the highest levels of TCDD. The toxicity of TCDD to animals is well-established. It is often considered to be the man-made compound most toxic to animals. Its toxicity to humans, however, is not as well-established. The only absolutely confirmed human health effect from exposure to TCDD is a skin rash called chloracne. Other health effects are suspected. It is considered a carcinogen on the basis of animal studies. TCDD is also an unwanted by-product of the manufacture of the herbicides 2,4-D and 2,4,5-T. A manufacturing accident at a plant manufacturing these chemicals occurred near Sevesto, Italy in 1976 released an estimated 1-10 lb of TCDD into the surrounding countryside, killing many farm animals and causing chloracne. Since 2,4-D and 2,4,5-T were components of the defoliant "Agent Orange" used in Vietnam, many U.S. servicemen (and of course Vietnamese) were exposed to elevated levels of TCDD. TCDD is thus suspected as the cause of the symptoms attributed to "Agent Orange" exposure. Richard E. Barrans Jr., Ph.D. Assistant Director PG Research Foundation, Darien, Illinois

So, I would not want to be breathing that stuff, but with a window open and maybe a fan, we've all probably done more dangerous stuff this week.

If it wasn't safe they never would have sold us the Autocutter, slice and Cauterize your finger with one convenient tool

although smoking plastic isnt a great idea, your coworker is being a big fat nancy. youll survive

thing to note.. you can pass dioxin to your kids. One of the nastier sideeffects are immunilogical and gastrointestinal issues. Up until the time my Father went to VietNam. nobody in our family had Intestinal problems. Nobody on my mom's side has any intestinal issues. My Father has Coilitus, I have Crohnes, and my sis has IBS...

Ah... you'll be fine. Tell him to....

Burning PVC is some seriously bad sh1t, as in it's one of the few toxins anyone will conclusively say "does cause brain tumors".

Speaking as someone who had one, albeit a quite unusual, very benign one in the best location and found incidentally in the course of an unrelated test....

I'm big on my respirators anymore. Melting a little styrene is probably OK but why risk it?

Hmm duly noted When I was a kid a lot of plastic was melted between my and my friends for RC-car related purposes.

What kinda plastic?

As stated, I am sure none are good for you...

But I would worry at lot less about something like polyethylene that is just going to produce carbon oxides then stuff like PVC, which is going to release some kinda of chlorine.

It do depend on the plastic. Generally it's not a short term health issue, it's a longer term. Especially the dioxins, if they are in the plastic you are burning.

Your choice to do it, his choice to avoid it.

Thanks guys, it's not something I spend hours a day doing. I'm not dead, so... As for what type of plastic - I don't know? This time I was cutting some holes in a data tape case. Probably the same stuff they make CD cases out of. I really don't know much about plastics... Occasionally I will also use the soldering iron to reseal plastic bags or stuff like that.

I was worried about "instant death" gases after remembering that article about the guy who made phosgene by heating brake-clean. I will have to be careful about PVC though, that sounds nasty.

Thing is, I'd bet the plastic fumes are no worse than the lead fumes from when you use a soldering iron for its intended purpose.

The plastic used in car interiors is ABS. That stuff cannot be recycled due to the release of dioxins as it's being melted. Were it me, I'd try my best to avoid melted plastic fumes, but small amounts with proper ventilation shouldn't be a problem.

Jensenman wrote: The plastic used in car interiors is ABS. That stuff cannot be recycled due to the release of dioxins as it's being melted.

I issued permits to two facilities here that recycle automotive interior plastics. You can certainly melt down abs and reuse it. Doesn't give off any more fumes than it does when initially melted down.

foxtrapper wrote:

Jensenman wrote: The plastic used in car interiors is ABS. That stuff cannot be recycled due to the release of dioxins as it's being melted.

I issued permits to two facilities here that recycle automotive interior plastics. You can certainly melt down abs and reuse it. Doesn't give off any more fumes than it does when initially melted down.

Not to add much, but there's been a pretty strong movement toward recycling interior parts over the last 10 years. So I'm not sure how much less ABS is used, but I do know that much of the "fluff" is recycled into pressed parts (like door panels).

Can't help with Jay, though.

Look on the bottom of the container - typicaly there will be a label embossed with letters and a recycle symbol with a number in it. You are safer (though none are particularly safe as all plastics contain toxins) if the logo is HPDE or LPDE - High (H) or Low (L) Density Polyethylene. Avoid plastics with "C" in that label as thats the chlorides that con create chlorine gas - deadly stuff. The number inside the recycle symbol refers to what recycling process is needed for that particular plastic - this can lend insight to what the plastic is made from if the lettering label is not visible.

that's good to know!