Every once and awhile, I come across an enticing deal on the 'next' used car. Often, the low price, relative to the market, is the presence of a salvage title. So is that a showstopper for you? Or simply grounds for a bit more thorough of a pre-purchase investigation? Can they be insured with a salvage title? Insights appreciated!
That depends, mostly on what it is and how much it costs. Lotus Elise? Most of them are salvaged due to cracks in the fascia. Not a huge deal, but now I know that I'm liability only for insurance so I need to be able to take a $30k hit. $2,000 Corolla? Could have been salvaged for hail damage. Don't care, and I can risk $2k. That being said, if it is something that is common and there isn't a huge price difference in a non-salvage one, there's no reason not to go for the non-salvage version, all else being equal. I expect a big discount with the salvage title. Note that I've owned a car with a salvage title, but never bought one.
Flood car? Probably not touching it - although my uncle buys flood cars for his kids. His RULE is to only buy cars with power seats, and he has to test the power seats. If they work, he'll do a deeper dive to see if he's interested. If they don't, he moves on. His theory is that the power seats are generally the lowest point of the car, and should be the first to fail in a flood. He said that he hasn't been burned once with a flood car doing this.
I don't mind one bit if a car has a salvage title. I never expect to make money or make even if I were to sell a car with one, so the value of it to me is meh. Although when I'm buying one from a dealer, I do expect there to be a hefty enough discount compared to one with a clean title.
Personally though, I don't and won't buy flooded cars. Things might work currently, but there's no telling a year or two down the road.
Some of this varies by state but I'm most certain that your Florida is the same as my Ohio...
I buy cars at insurance auctions and put them back on the road. When I buy the cars they have a Salvage Title. In general this means the car is not fit to be on the road. Because it is not fit to be on the road, the state will not issue plates for the car. Your insurance company will not protect you for driving the car since it is "not fit for the road."
Once I own the salvage car, I then fix it enough to pass the state standards. I take it to the official state salvage inspection station where they look over my repairs and paperwork. If the car passes then it is given a Rebuilt Title. This means that car is once again safe to be on the road. It can be titled in any state and driven in any state. I have never had my various insurance companies not be willing to insure a car that is Rebuilt.
So, there is some confusion out the in Salvage and Rebuilt. The CL ad might have the wrong term and it really is rebuilt (good for the road), or it might really be Salvage (not good for the road.) A reason it might actually be Salvage is that the guy bought it thinking it would be an easy fix and now he has discovered that it will be hard to fix so he wants out. I can buy a Salvage car (not safe for the road) and sell you a Salvage car but that means that the car is still not approved to be on the road.
Going even further, Florida has another designation called Certificate of Destruction. That means that this specific VIn can never go back on the road. Cars like this usually have significant damage but can be a good deal if you need a drivetrain donor.
I've owned a couple cars with salvage titles, but both were very, very cheap. I would never spend "real" money on one, because just like you have questions about buying it so would anyone you go to sell it to down the road. I would expect a significant discount off retail value before even considering a more expensive salvage title car. (Like, 30% - 50% discount, not 10%.) That said, the $500 Lexus LS400 that I bought with a broken timing belt and salvage title was nice transportation for two or three years then I sold it on to another GRM member super quickly and painlessly for exactly what I paid for it. (Not counting repairs, of course.)
Depends on the use case. Reliable daily driver? Maybe, maybe not, depending on the reason it was salvaged. Cheap race car for the GRM challenge? Absolutely.
They can be fine or they can be absolutely terrible. I've owned a lot but bought them directly from auction so I knew their history somewhat.
I'd only buy one if I knew exactly why it was salvage and not just taking the seller's word. Inspect it or get it professionally inspected. Once in a while it actually can be "minor cosmetic damage" but there's usually a pretty good reason. Don't pay much for one and don't expect to sell it easily or get much out of it down the road.
I know a guy who gets cars from the insurance auction and then fixes them, gets the rebuilt titles, and sells them. He makes some money doing it, but I don't really know if it's "real job" money or what. I've picked some of them up for him and they all run and drive but all have a corner of the car missing. None of them seem to be real hard hits and it doesn't take him too long to get them turned around. I wouldn't hesitate to get one of those rebuilt cars with the intention that I'd drive most of the value out of it. If I thought I wanted to ever try to re-sell the car, or if I didn't have a chance to see the "before" condition of the car, I would be pretty hesitant. Keep in mind that the "inspection" that the state does is really looking at paperwork to check for stolen parts and has nothing to do with the actual condition of the car beyond lights, wipers, and window glass.
Salvage just means pay less for it, and get a very comprehensive pre-purchase inspection.
In reply to John Welsh :
In ohio is there anything on the rebuilt title to give the history of the title. IE the seller claims it was a theft recovery when actually the car was wrecked, caught fire, then rolled into a flood.
Sorry, I didn't read the thread. To me? Only 2 reasons to buy a salvage car:
1. You have the cash and absolutely don't care what you drive.
2. Race car time.
In reply to wae :
Every word you have written is my exact experience too.
Thanks all. Great advice, as usual.
What z31maniac says. There's a guy on the 996 Turbo group trying to sell his salvage titled 996tt for $40k, which is totally unrealistic. He'll be lucky to get $25k for it.
I wouldn't touch a salvage title car unless it was stupidly cheap, like I could sell a few parts off of it and recoup my entire purchase price. Reselling it will be a chore and do you really know what totalled it and how well it was fixed?
gearheadmb said:In reply to John Welsh :
In ohio is there anything on the rebuilt title to give the history of the title. IE the seller claims it was a theft recovery when actually the car was wrecked, caught fire, then rolled into a flood.
Example. I bought a Prius that needed a front bumper cover. The receipt that I provide the inspector for the bumper cover is then stamped by the inspector with a state seal. I leave with some documentation from the inspector of what has been replaced.
I imagine that if the person you are buying from was also the rebuilder it would be reasonable to ask to see these documents.
However, I do not think there is a publicly available Ohio State database that would say this car rebuilt 5 years ago and 2 owners ago was actually just a bumper cover and not a deep flood car.
There was this ad on Viper Forums that was so nuts...Car was perfect, looked really good, right mods, good but not rediculous price, former Hennessy car (say what you will but the Vipers were cool). Very last line "Oh yeah rebuilt title"
Like finding out that cute girl at the bar has a willie. Oh hell no.
Meh, it wouldn't scare me off.. up here in CT, I bought a truck that was a salvage title. It's a 2000 Chevy 2500 HD with the 6.5L turbo diesel. I got it for 3k 4 or 5 years ago. It was salvaged because it slid off the road into a pole which dented in the bed and bored bowed the front of the bed a bit, along with some other scratches.
The 8' bed was only available from Chevy, and the paint and misc made this truck not worth repairing at a ~9k repair. I paid a local shop 1 1/² hours of labor to bang it approximately back into shape and ran it through the recert inspection. It's been a great truck for me!
It is incredibly rare that I buy a salvage title car. Reason? 95% of the time you are throwing your money away. I bought a Sonoma that I had seen the before and after. The before was a side-swipe. Since it involved all the driver's side body panels (but had no frame, suspension, or wheel involvement) I knew it was a good vehicle. Got it for a bargain $2500 (book value was around 4500) The shop had already repaired it by hanging three new panels (a matching black bed they had out back, junkyard door that already matched, and new fender). It actually looked incredible, so $2500 was a bargain.
I drove it for two years and then had a need for a bigger truck. It took 5 months to sell it for $1000, and I had to go about 300 miles to deliver it. People don't care if you explain all the damage and even show them pictures, it's branded, so it's useless. With the thousands of other compact pickups on the market, why would they even consider a salvage title like mine?
The only time I will consider buying a salvage title is if I purchase it dirt cheap, I do the work to save money, and it's a super-rare piece. Think Audi R8 with the cracked aluminum frame. At least when you sell it later, the cracked frame is a known thing, and there is actually a fair market for a salvage R8.
I know some people say "I don't plan on ever selling this [insert salvage title vehicle]."
You're right. You're not. At least not without significant hurdles. Buy a NON salvage vehicle and drive it until it's wasted and dead and you can still sell it for $500. Buy the same car as a salvage title and you couldn't sell it the next day for $500. Exaggeration, but you get the picture.
docwyte said:What z31maniac says. There's a guy on the 996 Turbo group trying to sell his salvage titled 996tt for $40k, which is totally unrealistic. He'll be lucky to get $25k for it.
I wouldn't touch a salvage title car unless it was stupidly cheap, like I could sell a few parts off of it and recoup my entire purchase price. Reselling it will be a chore and do you really know what totalled it and how well it was fixed?
Do you have a link to that car?
As to buying salvage cars. I don't have a problem with it and have owned several, a couple of theft recoveries, wrecks, and one "flood" which was were the drains stopped up and fried some stuff in the engine bay once wet. You just need to understand they can be aggravating to sell depending on the price point etc. In my experience, the older the car the less it matters.
In this part of the world, and I think through most of Canada, there are three designations, just like Mr Welsh said. Here, they are Total Loss, Rebuilt, and Non-repairable. We also have to have two inspections done at a registered inspection station- A Body Integrity inspection, which involves them seeing the vehicle before repair, then seeing it again after repair but before paint. It gets the final sticker after paint. Then, it goes for a mechanical inspection, which is your average tire tread, suspension, brake, broken windshield situation. The inspections end up costing around $500 all in.
Rebuilt titles still carry a bit of a stigma as far as resale, but there are no insurance compromises. When I sell one, I point out that its just had a government certification...Sometimes that works. Other times, not so much.
And non-repairable means water, extreme rust, or really major collision damage. They are parts, or race cars.
In reply to Cotton :
Nope, it popped up in the 996 Turbo Facebook group, it's Speed Yellow. Guys on crack, so the chances of you buying it for a decent price are zero.
Hey I know a guy selling a 260 mile Boxster S with a salvage title for $35,000.
I guess it depends on the state too. Here in Arizona, you can drive anything on the street you can insure. I needed a crew cab truck, but didn't want to pay big money for it, so I got a Rebuilt Salvage Toyota Tundra DC Limited for $6000 with 175k when I bought it.
It's been trouble free for 30,000 miles and until I can afford a crew cab truck that gets 20+ MPG, there isn't much reason to upgrade/sell.
A salvage title just means that at some point an insurance company decided that a “proper” repair would cost close to the value of the car. On a newer car, it would usually take a fairly significant event (in terms of repair dollars) to get to that point. On an older car, minor body and paint work could total it. I wouldn’t be as concerned with an older car, but I would prefer to buy as is unrepaired rather than a car that had already been repaired.
My truck has a salvage title, but I bought it new and then bought it back after it was totaled by my insurance company. It was fairly new when totaled, about 5 years and 60k miles. I got rear ended, and the very tip of the frame where the bumper mounts was bent ever so slightly. High strength steel frame, the manufacturer said no bending or welding allowed. The proper fix was a new frame, so totaled. I took the payoff and bought it back. I had to have it inspected, but since nothing that affecting driveability was damaged, I didn’t need to do a thing to it. The only downsides are resale, and insurance is a bit weird. No problem getting insurance, can even get full coverage still, but I’d have to pay the rate of a regular truck but only be covered for the salvage value.
Back in the day I had a Tercel. Fully insured, although it was getting to the point where I was considering dropping to just liability. The car had reached a point where it was worth about $3000. Before I got around to ditching the collision and comp, we had a hail storm which dimpled the hood and both front fenders a bit.
I made a claim knowing I could decline it later. They totaled it, offered me $2500 ($3000 value minus $500 deductible) and then I could buy it back for $450. No brainer. They sent me a check for $2050 and I dropped to liability only. In effect, I traded my Tercel for an exact same Tercel with some dimples in the hood and pocketed two grand.
But, I no longer had a $3000 car. I had a $500 car. Even if I tried to sell it to someone who didn't care about 15 dimples, or someone who wanted to replace the hood and fenders with junkyard panels, it had a branded title. The chances of finding someone who would want it at all, let alone someone ill-informed enough to pay.
If I had planned on selling it, I would have declined the claim and sold it for normal money. I planned on driving it into the ground, so I took the money.
From the department of irony.... two weeks later my wife at the time totaled it 5 blocks from our house. (no injuries) I was there before the emergency responders were. I took the title, signed it, and left it on the dash for the tow truck.
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