Ubuntu Linux question

I know there are a few Linux users on here, and some that use Ubuntu. I just installed Ubuntu 11.10 on one of the machines here and I am very disappointed. With or without running Unity, the performance is doggie-doo slow. Granted the box is no barn-burner, but I don't expect a P4 to bog when I'm running Linux. I have no issues with 10.10 or 10.04LTS. It seems to me that Ubuntu is getting away from the things that drew me to it in the first place. It's starting to mimic the typical Microsoft bloatware.

My question: What's a more efficient, simpler version of Linux that is still easy to install and has good hardware support?

While I've never used them, IIRC Xbuntu and Kubuntu are stripped down versions. One is intended for kiosks, so it's proably not what you need, though I don't recall which one it is.

Anyone with any experience with Lubuntu?

1988RedT2 wrote: It seems to me that Ubuntu is getting away from the things that drew me to it in the first place. It's starting to mimic the typical Microsoft bloatware. My question: What's a more efficient, simpler version of Linux that is still easy to install and has good hardware support?

All distributions eventually start to suffer from feature bloat as they try to become more user friendly. kill the daemons you don't need for the stuff you do. (That's a good choice for security, too.)

I experimented with Lubuntu and found it pretty good on low-end hardware, but it is sort of stripped down. Same for Puppy Linux. I've heard decent things about Xubuntu, but I haven't tried it.

Right now my go-to distro is Mint. I've got an old box hooked up to my TV with a Mint 11 Katya / Mint 12 Lisa dual-boot, and an Asus netbook dual-boot running Katya and Ubuntu Lucid. Both Lucid and Katya run fine on the netbook, so they should be no problem on your P4.

I've only just started playing with Mint Lisa, but initial impressions are mixed. The Cinammon desktop makes for a more GNOME2-like experience, but I think it's still more resource-hungry. I'd stick with Katya for your application right now.

damn, I wish there was an English version of all this

wbjones wrote: damn, I wish there was an English version of all this

Sorry.

I can translate on request.

puppy is fun to play with... don't even need a HDD, just a small USB jump drive and a CD drive will do the trick for initial install...

my aunt is giving us an older p4 computer from her business that i'm planning on setting up with some basic version of liniux for the kids computer...

Mint is nice, Debian is great if you consider yourself pretty saavy at getting things to work.

Basically you have a swiss army knife in Ubuntu. You need to find the services and features that are killing your performance and turn them off.

> ps -ef | less

Will show you what is running.

> top

Will show you how much it is consuming

> memstat will help too

Daemons (Services for Win folks) are in /etc/init.d/ and you can turn off the ones you don't want using a GUI tool if you don't know what I am talking about.

Are you CPU bound or swapping memory to disk? Did you create a swap partition? Is it at the beginning of the disk? Are you sure your video is not running a generic framebuffer instead of a real driver? Are you comparing a p4 to a new i7 and just having unreal expectations? Lots of questions - no context to give you answers.

I can probably help you optimize what you have - Ubuntu can be as fast as any distro but "It's slow" isn't enough info. Post up some ps/top/memstat output to help us find the low hanging fruit.

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote: Are you CPU bound or swapping memory to disk? Did you create a swap partition? Is it at the beginning of the disk?

Check this ^.

Details here.

Ubuntu by default sets "swappiness" (the strength of the tendency to swap stuff in memory out to the swap partition on disk) to 60 (of 100 max), which seems to be insanely high.

Seems like it takes more memory than I would like to do what I want to do, but with 4GB of RAM and swappiness set to 10, my performance is vastly improved. I had some insane lag previously, sometimes getting to the point that the system took forever to get to a terminal so I could start killing stuff...

Okay, so I changed the swappiness to 10 and it seems a little better. The swap partition is the 1.1 GB Ubuntu installed by default. I think I am running without a proper video driver. The video is some Intel graphics on a Dell Dimension 2350.

Here's ps:

UID PID PPID C STIME TTY TIME CMD
root 1 0 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 /sbin/init
root 2 0 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [kthreadd]
root 3 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [ksoftirqd/0]
root 5 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:04 [kworker/u:0]
root 6 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [migration/0]
root 7 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [cpuset]
root 8 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [khelper]
root 9 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [netns]
root 10 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [sync_supers]
root 11 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [bdi-default]
root 12 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [kintegrityd]
root 13 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [kblockd]
root 14 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [ata_sff]
root 15 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [khubd]
root 16 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [md]
root 17 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:03 [kworker/u:1]
root 19 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [khungtaskd]
root 20 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [kswapd0]
root 21 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [ksmd]
root 22 2 0 16:48 ? 00:00:00 [khugepaged]
:

Ok, so I've been on an Ubuntu hiatus for about 2 years and just picked up an old IBM X31 from the trash pile at work.

After combining 3 x31's I've got a FREE 1.6ghz, 2gb ram, 6 cell laptop of yesteryear. Right now it's running XP. I've triad dual boot with the newest Ubuntu (slowwwwwww, wtf?) and I'm more then disappointed.

So without thread jacking, any direction on what I should try? Am I stuck with xp?

In reply to 1988RedT2:

How much memory do you have in this box?

I haven't gone wading around shutting stuff off (though I probably should, as others have recommended), and I tend to want to have Firefox (with numerous tabs open), Thunderbird, and PS3 Media Server running all the time (as well as a few smaller things).

That was enough that 2GB really wasn't enough memory in my case. For the reduced swappiness to really help, there has to be enough free RAM that it's not forced to swap to disk...

As GPS points out, the "top" command will give you your biggest offenders...

Wow. Lotsa stuff here:

25112k: PID 1434 (/usr/lib/gnome-settings-daemon/gsd-printer)
10408k: PID 1438 (/usr/bin/metacity)
17604k: PID 1440 (/usr/bin/gnome-screensaver)
44016k: PID 1445 (/usr/bin/gnome-panel)
17712k: PID 1448 (/usr/bin/pulseaudio)
25056k: PID 1452 (/usr/lib/d-conf/dconf-service)
384k: PID 1458 (/usr/lib/pulseaudio/pulse/gconf-helper)
26816k: PID 1460 (/usr/lib/gnome-settings-daemon/gnome-fallback-mount-hel... 27196k: PID 1461 (/usr/bin/nm-applet)
28312k: PID 1462 (/usr/bin/nautilus)
18680k: PID 1463 (/usr/lib/policykit-1-gnome/polkit-gnome-authentication-... 10336k: PID 1465 (/usr/bin/gnome-sound-applet)
18416k: PID 1466 (/usr/bin/bluetooth-applet)
628k: PID 1475 (/usr/lib/gvfs/gvfs-gdu-volume-monitor)
8540k: PID 1487 (/usr/lib/gvfs/gvfs-afc-volume-monitor)
724k: PID 1490 (/usr/lib/gvfs/gvfs-gphoto2-volume-monitor)
17596k: PID 1493 (/usr/lib/notify-osd/notify-osd)
488k: PID 1499 (/usr/lib/gvfs/gvfsd-trash)
340k: PID 1501 (/usr/lib/gvfs/gvfsd-burn)
16864k: PID 1502 (/usr/bin/telepathy-indicator)
484k: PID 1505 (/usr/lib/telepathy/mission-control-5)
1212k: PID 1518 (/usr/lib/gnome-disk-utility/gdu-notification-daemon)
33424k: PID 1521 (/usr/bin/zeitgeist-datahub)
15216k: PID 1527 (/usr/bin/python2.7)
292k: PID 1528 (/bin/cat)
6592k: PID 1538 (/usr/bin/python2.7)
35300k: PID 1542 (/usr/bin/update-notifier)
25060k: PID 1563 (/usr/lib/deja-dup/deja-dup/deja-dup-monitor)
264500k: PID 1765 (/usr/lib/firefox-9.0.1/firefox)
29328k: PID 1934 (/usr/lib/firefox-9.0.1/plugin-container)
25192k: PID 15886 (/usr/lib/gvfs/gvfsd-http)
29532k: PID 16424 (/usr/bin/python2.7)
35836k: PID 16443 (/usr/bin/gnome-terminal)
2044k: PID 16449 (/bin/bash)
1104k: PID 16503 (/usr/bin/memstat)

Oh, and just 1 GB RAM. It's only got 2 slots and they're full. Good thing it's cheap, I guess.

In reply to 1988RedT2:

Ah, yeah... That's not much RAM. Other folks' tuning observations may help, but more memory's going to be huge.

OR

As per your original inquiry, perhaps try something that's not using Gnome or KDE. That's a lot of overhead right there... I keep meaning to try Xubuntu, but I haven't yet. Even on a machine that runs KDE fine, I keep thinking it would be snappier...

top - 18:22:49 up 1:34, 1 user, load average: 0.28, 0.14, 0.14 Tasks: 123 total, 1 running, 122 sleeping, 0 stopped, 0 zombie Cpu(s): 9.3%us, 2.0%sy, 0.0%ni, 88.7%id, 0.0%wa, 0.0%hi, 0.0%si, 0.0%st Mem: 1025040k total, 895716k used, 129324k free, 73868k buffers Swap: 1045500k total, 16k used, 1045484k free, 513072k cached

PID USER PR NI VIRT RES SHR S %CPU %MEM TIME+ COMMAND
16443 andrew 20 0 74464 14m 10m S 5.3 1.5 0:04.53 gnome-terminal
933 root 20 0 81420 28m 4448 S 3.0 2.8 2:33.50 Xorg
1934 andrew 20 0 116m 34m 16m S 2.0 3.5 0:56.81 plugin-containe
1765 andrew 20 0 431m 89m 29m S 0.3 9.0 2:55.48 firefox
16546 andrew 20 0 2820 1132 856 R 0.3 0.1 0:00.15 top
1 root 20 0 3332 1792 1212 S 0.0 0.2 0:00.93 init
2 root 20 0 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 kthreadd
3 root 20 0 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.77 ksoftirqd/0
5 root 20 0 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:06.70 kworker/u:0
6 root RT 0 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 migration/0
7 root 0 -20 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 cpuset
8 root 0 -20 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 khelper
9 root 0 -20 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 netns
10 root 20 0 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.01 sync_supers
11 root 20 0 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 bdi-default

Yah, my first system had 4 MEGs of RAM, so this whole "more than a GB" thing freaks me out a little. But I agree, nothing speeds a system up like more RAM. The irony is that the lady that gave me this system had me add more RAM to it about a year ago. I think it went from 256M to 1 GB. That was when it was running XP. Needless to say, it wasn't happy. She got a new box for Christmas and let me have this one for the kids to use.

Anything I can do with the video short of adding a card? I can't find Linux drivers for the onboard video.

1slowcrx wrote: Ok, so I've been on an Ubuntu hiatus for about 2 years and just picked up an old IBM X31 from the trash pile at work. After combining 3 x31's I've got a FREE 1.6ghz, 2gb ram, 6 cell laptop of yesteryear. Right now it's running XP. I've triad dual boot with the newest Ubuntu (slowwwwwww, wtf?) and I'm more then disappointed. So without thread jacking, any direction on what I should try? Am I stuck with xp?

Try a dual boot with Ubuntu 10.04 LTS. It's what I'm running on my main box right now, and I've been VERY happy with it.

In fact, I'd be running it on this box, but for some reason I can't get the wireless to work in 10.04 LTS. With 11.10 it works great.

I have a 11.04 here with an old dual core pentium and 2G of RAM that is really fine for general programming/compiling - even Eclipse/java which is a giant hog.

You said you were concerned about the video driver. Make absolutely sure you get some GPU acceleration from your card - frame buffering will clobber your CPU. Do an lspciand look for the VGA controller. Snag the number and hit google to see what kernel module or driver you "should" be loading.

Then grep modprobe -l and look thru for it. If it isn't loaded , google for 'Ubuntu (version) (module name) not working' and you will find an answer.

If it is loaded - make sure it is configured correctly and then scratch that off the reason list. We can move on to other bottlenecks.

Well, I have the Intel 82845G/GL Brookdale chipset (rev 03). Seems to be a lot of chatter about problems with the hardware. Current driver is i915, but I don't know how to tell if it's configured right or even if it's causing a problem.

Hmm. Doesn't seem to be listed in modprobe. Last line is in fact "initrd/vesafb.ko" which I'm guessing is bad.

Also, in a system benchmark app I'm getting:

Open GL:
Vendor Unknown
Renderer Unknown
Version Unknown
Direct Rendering No

You can change the default window manager without uninstalling Ubuntu. Go to the package manager utility and you can download other lighter weight window managers to try. Xfce and LXDE are two good candidates you can look at for lightweight window managers. The best part is that if you don't like them, switching back to Unity is as simple as the dropdown box on the login screen.

I may or may not have an extra AGP video card in my graveyard, which I think should work as I've got a Dell of similar vintage. You can have it for very very cheap. I'll check and PM you if I find one.

EDIT: Sorry, totally missed the "with or without Unity" part. Maybe try rolling back to 10.10 or 11.04? One of those two versions may have better wireless support for you, without the Unity parts that slow everything down so much.

Unity killed me on Ubuntu. For the first time ever, my linux side was running slower than my Windows side, and I run Vista.

If you like the Ubuntu experience, it looks like Mint is really taking over there. If you don't need all the GUI hand-holding, try the LXDE version instead of the Gnome setup; that drops a whole bunch of resource usage right off the top.

What I use is Crunchbang. Crunchbang is basically debian stable using Openbox. Bar none, it is the fastest distro I've ever used, however it also has required the most involvement from me. FWIW, I have not done anything with Arch, Archbang, or Gentoo, which all potentially could be a faster system when built, but take more involvement up front. I'll take the tradeoff

One of the things I really like about Crunchbang is they have an active and very helpful community in their forums. I don't know that I've run into a question that I couldn't find the answer to searching through there or getting an answer to relatively quickly after posting a thread.

Yeah, you are using the Vesa Framebuffer. It is definitely an issue that will effect performance.

Just to make sure what you have going on... run: sudo lshw -C display

It should spill out the capabilities and configured driver, etc. Looking thru here might answer the "How do I get it to work" part. https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel

The on-board intel stuff gave me fits on a debian laptop - the answer was to create an xorg.conf file to specify exact timings for the X server. It never did do 3D but it had good performance for 2D stuff. If I had the option I'd throw a $30 nVidia card in the PCI slot and call it a day.