My 2008 expedition almost hit 250k miles before a deer took it out. Even with its age it still did everything really well. We have a family of tall people (4 of us right around 6 ft) with room for pets. Could tow my open trailer effortlessly & did my enclosed trailer without too much complaining.
Looking at newer expys they switched to the 3.5 ecoboost and there was a gen change in 2018. The eb engines has some cam phaser issues I've heard but don't know if that's just internet talk or a real issue.
So what else can tow 7-9k and hold a family of full sized people? 4wd, leather, quiet, etc. Is there a mileage limit on these new fangled engines?
I'm in Michigan so anything 10 years old is crusty - would not be opposed to a fly & drive.
I'm in almost the same boat, my 2000 expedition isn't what it needs to be anymore. I am focusing on 2017 Expedition EL, also in MI and expecting a fly and drive! Seems like suburbans of similar vintage are much more expensive and higher miles, and still seem to have concerns.
Seems like the lowest miles you can find are still 70k or so.
docwyte said:
Suburban, Sequioa...
I'm looking at both of these. Living in Florida makes it easier, my budget will be a fraction of what Kendall has in mind.
AWD Chevy Express van. More interior room in the same (or smaller) footprint.
Still loving my 2015 Expedition. I haven't heard of cam phaser issues with the 3.5EB, but I have heard of water pumps, though I think they are a bigger issue in the FWD applications of this engine. Also, carbon buildup like any other GTDI engine. Mine has been rock solid so far, currently at 88k.
I will say this, once you tow with the 3.5EB, you'll wonder how you ever did it with the 5.4. The torque is really impressive.
We are almost a year into my wife's 2019 Expedition Max and she loves it. I'd say it's the best overall people/stuff/towing combo. Much better third row space than everything else besides the newest Suburbans. It drives much smaller than it is, and is much faster than you would expect. We bought ours with the Ford Certified warranty, which gives a bit of extra piece of mind. We'd had a few issues. Common ones are a sunroof bracket that cracks and a hairline crack in a valve cover that is common it low mileage. It took about 6 months to get a valve cover they are so back ordered. The rear seat heaters needed repair. The big one was the transmission. It had shifting problems, I guessed it was a common issue with an easy fix, but they replaced the whole transmission. It's been great since everything was fixed, but that's quite a bit for under 40k. At least everything was under warranty. But compared with the previous Sienna and Telluride, with zero issues between them over more miles, it feels like a lot of problems for such low mileage. That said, it does more than either of those could do. I think the cam phaser issue is related to how well the oil is maintained. Look for oil change records, or if the TSB has been completed. 2019+ Expeditions have both direct and port injection, so no carbon build up issues.
Just a warning if you are looking at fly and drives. Lots of these were rentals, and shipped out of state for sale. I was shocked how many for sale here in CA. You don't want to fly somewhere just to find one that came from the rust belt. Carfax was good for following the history. I paid a bit more for a local, non rental Expedition.
I have a 2015 Expedition EL 4x4. I bought it at 65k and it currently has just under 130k. At least 10k miles towing 7k lbs around the country. I change oil every 5k miles, they need plus every 50k miles. My biggest gripe is the transmission when going up-hill without a load at low speed. Entering my neighborhood there is a hill with a 20mph speed limit, my transmission wants to do it in 5th gear and that's just too high. 3rd would be best. Its a PITA to work on because it's tucked low and fast back into the engine bay.
I haven't had any catastrophic issues, knock on wood. The trans does have a 4th gear chirp but I've been driving with that for 13k miles and no issues. When I first got it, it had a torque converter issue where it would sound like you're driving over rumble strips at 60mph. That was replaced under warranty.
I read a lot about 3.5 eco boost needing timing chains eventually and that's expensive even to DIY. I haven't had any rattle so I'm assuming mine is good.
It's fast, gobs of low-end and mid-range torque. If you have a 2015-2017 Expedition then you can do all the same engine mods and tunes as a 2014 f150. I could only imagine how fast it would be with some turbos, downpipes and a tune. The 2018+ is even better with more power and gears.
I would say buy one with good history and oil changes every 5k miles or less.
I love my 2500 Suburban. I'd fight you if you tried to buy it from me.
Regarding fly and drive -- I'm not from MI but I've been here for about five years. I want to throw this out as a "just in case":
just in case you're either from the rust belt and haven't really ever experienced rust free cars, or maybe it's been a while and you've just started to take rust for granted, let me remind you that rust is not actually a "given" on cars. Breaking bolts and crumbling rocker panels are foreign to some entire regions of the country. it's only a few hours south of here that rust simply does not happen. People like me who come from out of state have aching in our souls when we see what happens to cars here, and that's mostly only the cosmetics. Things so much worse are happening on the underbody.
$2,800 of my $3k into a "free" Michigan car is due to rust killing things. When I moved here I bought a $600 Ford E350 and sold it half a year later for $2,000, losing $1,200 in the process -- and all thanks to rust. BUT the reason I got it in the first place is that in some parts of the country, getting a running, driving car for $600 is a no-lose proposition because rust doesn't destroy everything beautiful
It's not worth the convenience. You gotta fly.
I towed with a 3.5 turbo Ford flex for a few years before upgrading to a Toyota tundra. The flex had much more usable power than the tundra when towing a trailer.
I took a look when i was searching and found that expeditions took a long time to get options. I specifically wanted active cruise control and couldn't get it without a nearly new vehicle.
GMT900 Yukon Denali or Escalade for the big 6.2L that will tow damn near anything and have torque for days. Delete the cylinder deactivation and keep the trans fluid clean. The Z55 air ride shocks in the rear are really nice for heavy loads when the auto-leveling is working right.
Avoid the stupid Z95 Magentic Ride Control option. The ride is awful even when it's working, when the struts leak the magic fluid out they are $500 a corner and unless you fork that out or do some wizardy the BCM throws an error and doesn't allow cruise control over 76mph and won't let you exceed 80mph by the pedal.
I thought the 6.2 didn't have DOD. Is that correct only in the trucks?
In reply to Floating Doc (Forum Supporter) :
I thought only the 2007-2008/9 6.2 didnt have DoD
In reply to yupididit :
You're probably right, hopefully someone can help answer this.
I would be remiss if I didn't toss 2.7T Silverado into your "should drive" mix.
Seriously. I love mine.
In reply to Floating Doc (Forum Supporter) :
I can verify that the 2011 6.2 has DOD.
Thanks all - glad to see the newer expys still get the job done. Its kinda too bad the ford window sticker website no longer works or is hit/miss. My 2008 expy - I was able to get the vin, run the build sheet and see that it had the towing package & larger (32 gallon) fuel tank option. Something no one would know unless they saw the window sticker / options it had.
And yes on the rust comments. I was 10 years out in washington state and the 2008 was bought out there & completely rust free until we got to MI 3 years ago. Thats the primary reason I didnt even look into a buy back. Its got bubbling all over just after 3 years. I did maintain it well - unless is was an emergency it only got motorcraft parts (fuel pump, oil filters, etc). Got it at 100K put almost another 150k on it without anything major, was hoping to keep it a looong time. Still have a set of studded snow tires for it.
And yes - fly & drive. DTW to ATL flights are 20 bucks(!) on mondays. However I see a lot of "rebuilt" trucks in ATL.
I need to know a lot more about DOD before I buy a truck.
LX570 or Land Cruiser if you have the budget, Sequoia if you don't.
Floating Doc (Forum Supporter) said:
I need to know a lot more about DOD before I buy a truck.
Nick D may be the right person to comment on this, he gets to fix all the ones that grenade themselves.
Having one and having a lot of friends that have trucks with DOD I would say what I have read on line is way worse than what I have seen in person. It does scare the E36 M3 out of me though because if a lifter collapses there is no easy repair. I honestly would prefer not to have it because my fuel economy sucks anyway, I don't think it stays in V4 mode enough to really make a difference, even if I am diligent about it.
NY Nick said:
Floating Doc (Forum Supporter) said:
I need to know a lot more about DOD before I buy a truck.
Nick D may be the right person to comment on this, he gets to fix all the ones that grenade themselves.
Having one and having a lot of friends that have trucks with DOD I would say what I have read on line is way worse than what I have seen in person. It does scare the E36 M3 out of me though because if a lifter collapses there is no easy repair. I honestly would prefer not to have it because my fuel economy sucks anyway, I don't think it stays in V4 mode enough to really make a difference, even if I am diligent about it.
I saw about a 2mpg increase after turning DOD off on my wife's 2011 Escalade. The hesitation at partial throttle is gone and the engine doesn't stutter going up hills anymore, the torque is always there and waiting.
Slightly smaller and at the lower end of the towing scale then the ones mentioned, but Hemi Durangos and Grand Cherokees can tow over 7K. The advantage is that they've been sold forever and you can probably find them in whatever spec, color, mileage configuration. Especially if shopping semi-nationwide.
If you need three rows it's sequoia, Tahoe/yukon, suburban, armada and expedition. Possibly Land Cruiser if you want to punish the third row passengers.
if you want storage behind the third row you want a Yukon xl, suburban or expedition el.
The 2015-2017 expeditions are nice. Kinda 1st gen eco boost but do ok. They do have some water pump and timing chain issues.
the suburbans save for a few have afm and weak sauce gm transmissions. My local mechanic who I trust, says don't look twice at one made from 2009-2015 unless it's the special years without AFM. From what I've seen some go forever with great Maint. Some get multiple sets of lifters and a head or two in 100k miles who knows.
So basically both have crippling multiple thousand dollar Achilles heals.
I wanted an expo or suburban recently but found I could get an f150 with the 2.7 eco boost that was newer and lower miles for less money. So I did that. Didn't fly and drive. Bought a Minnesota truck. It's great super rust free. Gotta love the aluminum bodies.
if I had unlimited cash, I'd get a new duramax suburban with the super cruise. I'd own it forever.
