Ok..
stupid POS not taken care of 98 corolla is towed to shop late last night, with a note that says something like "car broke down after hours so i got towed in. heres my info. I think my fuel filter is clogged.
I try to start it around noon, clicks over but wont start. jump it off and it starts right up. drive it in, leave it running, check V at battery after it charges for a bit, steady 14.15v
leave it running to see if it has an ignition problem that causes it to cut out when hot, never died on us.
put a battery in the car and, even though its integral to the pump, customer wanted us to change the filter out.
Go to start the car now (probably around 1430, car ran from about 12-1245) and no start, seems like it's not getting fuel. pulled off one of the wires at the coil pack and it was sparking so we throw a fuel pump in her, still no start.
Crank it over with line disco'd (no fuel gauges or anything else useful at this shop) and fuel is shooting out so the new pump is working, pull the plug wires and theres oil puddled in there. all 4, cyl 3 is the worst though.
order plugs and wires (wires were crap, prob the originals, 3/4 weren't arcing at the plug end but were at the coil end)on our dime now, pull the olds out, try to suck some oil out, put rags over the plug wells, and crank her over to get some of the oil out so they dont foul out immediately so we can get rid of the POS. New plugs and wires in and the POS still doesn't start, new wires are sparking, customer is pissed that his pos wasn't fixed in one day with minimal diag, so what I'm asking is, where did I/we go wrong in the diag and what should I have done different. Thinking the oil problem at least is VC gasket unless theres something common in these early 1zz's?
gimme yer advice plzzz! =]
First, stop hucking parts at it. It may very well need plugs and wires and valve cover gaskets and so on, but none of those things are going to make it not run.
You have spark, but do you have it in the right place, at the right time? Output from a coil tells you the primary side of the ignition is ok, but you need to see spark at the plugs to be confident of the secondary. The simple fact that it ran for a while means the timing is roughly where it should be- both spark and cam.
A sharp ear will tell you if the crank sensor, or pickup coil, or whatever is working- If the fuel pump runs when you crank the engine, it means the ecu can see an rpm signal.
"Seems like its not getting fuel" is not a useful thing to say. The pump can be checked by listening, or better, by a scope on the power wire. That will also show you pump rpm, and whether there is a bad segment on the commutator. What is the fuel pressure? Not, "It sprays fuel everywhere," get a gauge and hang it. Are the injectors pulsing? Stethoscope works great for that. If not, are you missing the power supply, or the grounding trigger from the ecu? Self powered LED test light is a wonderful tool for that.
Find the main EFI relay and bang on that a bit.
"You drive a dilapidated pofs toilet rice burner with no visible upkeep.... Go eat a bag of dicks for being stupid. Go elsewhere."
Outside of something crazy like a large battery drain, IE- starter possibility, I think you already have your answer.
corytate wrote: so what I'm asking is, where did I/we go wrong in the diag and what should I have done different.
Threw a fuel pump at it without verifying that it was the problem.
We'll cross-verify things three ways from Sunday before concluding a diagnosis just for this reason. Throwing parts at a car just makes for upset customers - they have just spent money on things other than fixing the car, AND you've told them that you found the problem - but now it's proven that you haven't.
We like to scope the fuel pump's amp pattern. You can see failing contacts plain as day on a scope, even if it never does act up. But it needs to be sold as "this MIGHT be the problem, we do see it as being something that IS failing..." And always replace the relay.
see, this is the problem with actually diagnosing anything, we really don't have anything useful in this shop. I am the only tech because the other guy worked out, and I am most definitely not a master tech. The store mgr has been helping me out alot.
No scope, no scan tool, no stethoscope, no brake cleaner (not allowed), no fuel gauges/compression tester/etc, etc
essentially what I diagnosed was the battery, which was actually bad. The customer wanted the filter done. when it wouldn't start after being reassembled, I I pulled the pump back out to ensure I didn't do something stupid like leaving the pump unplugged.
Everything was together right, got the manager, he pulled the wire, sold the fuel pump. I put the pump in, still no start, we pulled plug wires and noticed the oil and the fact that the wires were crap. Thinking that there was no way in hell the car would run with 4 bad plugs we put new ones in to get rid of the POS. still no start but it tries to and sounds like it almost catches.
I mentioned our ghetto fuel test because it at least shows the pump is pumping something (before we sold the pump I at least checked that the pump was getting power and signal)
and this is also what I hate abotu aftermarket shops, these stupid cheapo aftermarket parts that don't work 50% of the time. We had a set of plugs the other day that were bad.
and this is also what I hate abotu aftermarket shops, these stupid cheapo aftermarket parts that don't work 50% of the time. We had a set of plugs the other day that were bad.
There's a huge amount of documentation on the 1zz no start issue online my friend. Get your read on. 
Apparently when swapping in cheapo aftermarket stuffs into a pump assy (aftmkt filter and pump kit) you have to make sure 100% that certain o-rings are swapped over and some aren't.
Corolla POS is outta here, The pump wasn't lined up right in the filter or something, dug through the dumpster to pull an o-ring and a little plastic spacer off the old one, fired her up, and ran like the POS that it is.
Thank god that heap is gone.
