Why do the automakers skimp out on manual transmissions?

wcelliot wrote:

hotg54b wrote: How many people actually know how to drive manuals? Ask around you'll be surprised how many can't drive stick.

And IMO that's one of the reasons that US drivers are so bad and getting worse... My daughter (21) is the only one of her friends that can drive a manual... and she was none too happy that we forced her to learn back when she was 16.

QFT.

[Rant On]

Newer cars are getting ready to drive themselves in a quiet cocoon for the riders. The strive to get to zero NVH has really made drivers self absorbed douchebags behind the wheel with the current NVH level. The noise level reduction has made "drivers" and I use that term VERY loosely, more like gliders of a four wheeled bubble of marshmallow fluff. New vehicles, at least to me, have ZERO feedback to the driver. The only feedback you get is when you have gone past the point of no return.

[Rant Off]

If the complaint is that the higher trim levels don't come with a stick - even with the same powerplant - then the only reason is to keep part numbers under control. If the complaint is that certain engines don't come with a stick, that could be due to strength or certification reasons.

Apparently something like 98% of new Cummins engines are attached to automatics. I'll have you all know that my new truck is an exception. So I've done my part to keep the manual transmission alive!

If you want to talk about a marshmallow and an isolationist bubble, you need to drive a 1966 Cadillac. It's nothing new.

Keith wrote: Apparently something like 98% of new Cummins engines are attached to automatics. I'll have you all know that my new truck is an exception. So I've done my part to keep the manual transmission alive!

There are certain benefits to having an auto behind a diesel nowadays though. I personally see it as a cost/benefit thing. Auto's are certainly good at some things. Manuals at others. To the person who said he has seen more manual trannies lately than autos, well I am not buying it. Sure is rare to find a car with a "blown" manual tranny, but autos explode on a regular basis due to poor maintenance.

If I'm driving a car for its performance, I better be doing the shifting, I don't care if its "faster" without me shifting. Rowing gears is an art.

With TD (or turbos in general) it's a more interesting discussion. When I was looking at building a 4BT hot rod (I wimped out and went sbc) 100% of the advice I got was to build it as an automatic because the performance would be superior... that the majority of guys who built manuals later converted to slushboxes. This had to do with the high low end torque and very narrow power band... which they claimed the auto made better use of.

Pure hot rod stuff... no towing, etc.

Buying new in a truck, I'd opt for a manual behind my oil burner as well!

Tom Heath wrote: I just wish new cars weren't so expensive....

Mrs Mini bought a 2010 Versa hatch a year ago. Six speed, cruise, air, decent cd/stereo, power windows, locks, plethora of airbags. Granted, it's not a bahn burner, but it moves along nicely, 34-36mpg highway, and was waaaay less than $13k out the door (8% tax inc.). So far, the only addition has been a set of used17" wheels and new tires. It handles decently and still rides nice. With the addition of some different springs/struts/ and bars, it should be fairly good fun at the local autoXs.

HiTempguy wrote:

Keith wrote: Apparently something like 98% of new Cummins engines are attached to automatics. I'll have you all know that my new truck is an exception. So I've done my part to keep the manual transmission alive!

To the person who said he has seen more manual trannies lately than autos, well I am not buying it.

Who said that?

Keith wrote: If you want to talk about a marshmallow and an isolationist bubble, you need to drive a 1966 Cadillac. It's nothing new.

Oh, I know it's nothing new, but back then you had to get the luxobarge model to get that kind of "performance". Everything else seemed to be an illhandling rattletrap. I was talking in the entry and mid level models of today.

As much as I hate this concept, you really should be certified to drive/buy vehicles beyond what is offered in driver's "education". Very much like getting a CDL to drive a semi or over 26k/passenger straight truck/van.

EricM wrote: I won't mid having a car with the shift paddle/button/thingies on the steering wheel.....

Mr. Clarkson would like to disagree with you: Stupid flappy paddle gearboxes!!!!

I think the market has shifted and the car manufactures havent caught on to it yet.
Traditionally the manual was the economy option where the automatic was the value added option.

Now days the only people who buy manuals are the enthusiasts, as an enthusiast I would be willing to pay more for a manual transmission than I would for a automatic transmission.

Therefore I think car companies could shift their marketing and pricing scheme for their manual transmissioned cars to take advantage of this(i.e. raise the price on the manuals because it wont really hurt sales)...

Yes I would hate paying more for a car but it would be better than being stuck with an autos only

That idiot who can't spell wrote: Amazingly most of my friends know how to drive stick.

from my experience most of the people that "know how to drive stick" don't know how to do it smoothly... sure they can get going... but it seems more like a fast and furious racer style driving... no finesse... or they are always fighting stalling... never in between... :-/

while in panama I had some fun driving around in a few diesel small trucks and vans... that was fun :)... no guts... but sure was fun with all that tourqe.

was neat spending time in central America and Europe... almost no auto tran cars to be seen...

I have had manual cars for years. My 2011 Fiesta has the twin clutch.No shift paddles but Ford has done some really interesting programming. For towing, an automatic is the best way to go.

Keith wrote: If the complaint is that the higher trim levels don't come with a stick - even with the same powerplant - then the only reason is to keep part numbers under control. If the complaint is that certain engines don't come with a stick, that could be due to strength or certification reasons.

My complaint is about both.

I think it's a load of crap though. I know the manufactures want to eventually drop the manual all together. I think I heard that 12% of new cars purchased are manual in the US.

Haing an automatic makes it much easier to drink coffe, smoke and talk on the cell phone while you are driving.

SyntheticBlinkerFluid wrote:

Keith wrote: If the complaint is that the higher trim levels don't come with a stick - even with the same powerplant - then the only reason is to keep part numbers under control. If the complaint is that certain engines don't come with a stick, that could be due to strength or certification reasons.

My complaint is about both. I think it's a load of crap though. I know the manufactures want to eventually drop the manual all together. I think I heard that 12% of new cars purchased are manual in the US.

Actually, I don't think there's a want to drop it all together, since so many are sold in Europe. But you can say that the customers are not exactly beating down the doors demanding them en-mass here in the US. And on that note, I don't agree with Capt Slow- if there was demand enough, price would not be an issue, since manuals ARE so much cheaper to make. I just don't see the desire. Don't equate GRM or boards like it to the rest of the 11 million Americans who bought cars in 2010.

In reply to alfadriver:

I am not trying to say that there is a lot of demand. I am trying to say that the demand that exists currently comes from people who want to have a manual and would be willing to pay a little extra to get one.

a lot of it depends on where the vehicle is sold. there's a manual option on the xterra and frontier, but the majority of them were sold in CO and UT. was like pulling teeth trying to find one in houston, and i finally settled for the auto. when i'd tell the sales guy what i wanted, they'd say "why ya want a manyal? and what are you gonna use a 4x4 for around here anyways?"

12%?!?!?! Are there enough car models out there to make those kinds of numbers?????

On the other subject that started here, I think that it should be mandatory for new drivers to learn to drive manual transmission. A friend and I were discussing this a few weeks ago. They should have to learn manual first and then move onto an automatic. A manual gives better sense into controlling your car.

Also, cars should be rated by horsepower and speed. Kids shouldn't be allowed to drive (on the street) certain vehicles until age 18 or 21.

I know that ruins the "dream" of owning a fast car when you're 16, but not every teen needs a V8 Mustang or Z32 Twin Turbo 3Z.

In reply to Ranger50:

It could have been 8%, I don't remember. It probably was the latter.

minimac wrote:

Tom Heath wrote: I just wish new cars weren't so expensive....

Mrs Mini bought a 2010 Versa hatch a year ago. Six speed, cruise, air, decent cd/stereo, power windows, locks, plethora of airbags. Granted, it's not a bahn burner, but it moves along nicely, 34-36mpg highway, and was waaaay less than $13k out the door (8% tax inc.). So far, the only addition has been a set of used17" wheels and new tires. It handles decently and still rides nice. With the addition of some different springs/struts/ and bars, it should be fairly good fun at the local autoXs.

That story does make me happy to hear, but to be honest, Im not terrily interested in a car that I have to poke and prod to be fairly fun at an autox...Id like something that is all out awesome at an Autox. CRX SI, MX5 turbo, fox body mustang etc...all fun out of the box, and credible on the leaderboards in showroom stock form...with a proper gearbox. I know the days of those cars is long gone, and now we have bloatmobiles that all soccermoms across this nation agree are superior to their neighbors cars...just the way god wanted.

Im starting to like korean cars simply for their simplicity. Anyone driven a Forte koup with 3 pedals? Inquiring minds want to know...but no soccermoms.

z31maniac wrote: Hey, this is a new topic that has never been discussed at length on this forum!

Ha, my thoughts exactly!

Keith wrote: Apparently something like 98% of new Cummins engines are attached to automatics. I'll have you all know that my new truck is an exception. So I've done my part to keep the manual transmission alive!

You must be talking about little trucks. REAL trucks (the ones where the Cummins engines are the SMALL ones) come with a lot more than 2% manual trans.

If you buy it, they will sell it. Pretty simple, guys. Buy a manual trans if you like it so much. If you're willing to buy a new car without a manual trans because you liked it enough with an automatic/automated manual, then why WOULD they offer a row-your-own box? On the other hand, if the cars with manuals are making more profit for companies than those without manuals, OEMs will take notice. I promise.

Bryce

i'm increasingly convinced I will have to live out life in old, used cars simply because automatics infuriate me. I hate them. I hate who invented them, I hate cars with them, and if I could animate inanimate objects like a child's cartoon, I would animate an automatic transmission first, so I could have the pleasure of punching it right in the face.

I have only 1 automatic, in my old Econoline. That vehical was free, and I would've paid money if it was a stick.

4cylndrfury wrote: Im starting to like korean cars simply for their simplicity. Anyone driven a Forte koup with 3 pedals? Inquiring minds want to know...but no soccermoms.

But that would require my local dealer to HAVE one of those particular models.... Altho given the sliminess of salespeople, I would suspect them to swap out the 2 pedals for 3 and it wouldn't function anyways.....

Rufledt wrote: i'm increasingly convinced I will have to live out life in old, used cars simply because automatics infuriate me. I hate them. I hate who invented them, I hate cars with them, and if I could animate inanimate objects like a child's cartoon, I would animate an automatic transmission first, so I could have the pleasure of punching it right in the face.

SAY WHAT SAY WHAT SAY WHAT SAY WHAT SAY WHAT SAY WHAT

In reply to 4cylndrfury:

You heard me. Right in the face