DirtyBird222 said:I came in here as I thought it was related to how this forum has become extra snippy and crusty lately. Lots of personal attacks and jabs at each other. I frequent this forum to avoid that kind of mentality from other more niche automotive related forums
In that respect I think it's actually better now than it's ever been
In reply to Duke :
No, you're not in that category from anything I've seen. And I agree with everything you are saying, I just don't care what people believe as long as its not shoved down my throat. Even then I'm usually polite and walk away.
slowride said:Is this what is referred to as "cancel culture"? I do think the news is covering stuff that shouldn't necessarily be covered (tweets, essentially). And that has caused people to try to go viral. There is a story today about how a toy monkey got lost at Buckingham Palace. Really?
Sort of. "Cancel culture" has more to do with stuff like loud voices (VICE, Vox, etc) that think people like Dave Chapelle shouldn't be allowed to play, or people who enjoy him are white supremacists......yes that's a real article. Or the controversy around the new guy that just fired from SNL before even taking part in one skit.
mad_machine said:In reply to aircooled :
Back in my days on FB, I was in a very good Buddhist group. They were quite accepting that because of my intestinal issues, i needed to eat some meat in order to survive. After all, even the Dali Lama eats some meat due to medical problems and there really is no prohibition against meat. Then the vegans moved in...
Strange.
You're supposed to accept the universe as it is. If you want to make a personal change that makes you happy then so be it but you must remember that having the desire to change is also having desire and you're supposed to be trying to not desire anything.
You're supposed to accept that there will be suffering and to do your best not to cause suffering. Being vegan or vegetarian is a way to not cause suffering but we're discovering that even plants can suffer. They should accept that all life feeds on on some other form of life.
Yeah, I always thought that of Buddhist also, then I meet a guy from Sri Lanka and he told me how they are going around blowing up Muslims.
As I like to say: you can pretty much take any group or type of person and there will always be a percentage of them that are a-holes and that is the real problem.
Torkel said:IMHO, the same stupid behavior (or simply "lacking manners") takes different form in different areas of our society. People get worked up and interfere in stuff that doesn't actually affect them, somehow missing that they are limiting other peoples freedom and happiness by doing so.
Religious people demonstrating outside an abortion clinic - You are free to follow your religion and you shouldn't be mocked for doing so. But it is YOUR religion, so why don't YOU refrain from abortions and let everyone else be? Telling random women that they will go to hell as they are about to do their lives hardest decision is just despicable.
Gay marriage - I think this is so sad. Why would anyone want to stop two adult, free and consenting citizens from getting married to each other? Again, you may apply your religion and/or your values to YOUR OWN marriage, not to other peoples marriage. As long as it doesn't effect you, just let people be.
My point is that this is the same behavior: It's OK to be a vegan, but it's not OK to take people to court just because they BBQ "too close" to your yard. It is ALSO not OK to harass some stranger you never met just because they earlier behaved badly and lost a court case.
With a risk of sounding a bit gloomy: I think this behavior is a bit of a toxin for society. It leads to people being defensive and assuming the worst from each other. Like the other day when I honked at a young woman on the mall parking lot. Her reaction was to flip me off and drive away... with her purse still on the roof of her car. If she had reacted with a more positive mindset, that could have been avoided. Of course, if the first 5 guys that honked at her that week hadn't behaved quite so juvenile and retarded, her mindset would perhaps been more positive.
Very well said and excellent points. I wonder if I’m saying that because I agree with your viewpoint or because I’m a shiny happy people?
ibtl
I wasn't going to answer because I generally agree that my opinion doesn't matter, but...
Social Media has spawned the ability to give people a big voice but furthermore it has given them an inflated sense that their voice is just so damn important.
Imagine if it were 1999. How would you successfully gather 4,000 people to attend your BBQ protest?
So, no one here runs FONOPS when challenged?
I see the problem like this-
The world has gotten to the point where everyone has gotten offended about everything- and everyone thinks they are owed everything. Equality has become so ridiculous it's getting to the point where it's gonna be the parent taking the nintendo because the kids can't share. Vegans want to scream loud enough to be heard because they think meat is murder. Meat eaters get so sick of their E36 M3 that they decide they're going to do the polar opposite and be as reactionary as possible. Hence, 4000 people showing up to tell the vegan to eat a bag of E36 M3. Now in this case, everyone is wrong. The vegan has no reason to believe that the meat eaters were doing it on purpose. Grillers gonna grill. She probably could have handled it much more discretely- but in todays society, the one that yells the loudest wins. The griller in question has the thought the same- I'm gonna yell louder. The problem is, we've reached an apex where counter-culture is becoming so mainstream that the fringes are what used to be mainstream. So, you've got a million people shouting for safe space and the world struggling to get it for them, and in the exact same breath, inadvertently taking away someone elses rights. Perfect example and one that bothers me personally-
cis-gender. Now I know what it means. Means hetero standard issue whatever. Guys that like girls and whatnot. Me, basically. Problem is everyone struggled so much to get their own label (asexual, gender fluid, pan...take your pick) they've gone and done EXACTLY what they wanted not done to them...saddle me with a title i'm pretty sure I don't want. You have the right to call yourself whatever you want and be addressed as such. I don't care. In that same breath you do not get to choose what you want for me. I'm honestly not even offended by it- I don't care who or what you call me. I am however deeply opposed to you choosing my rights for me... and this is universal. You absolutely have the right to not eat meat. Eat pinecones for all I care. That doesn't mean you get to tell me, or anyone else for that matter, that they can't. People need to accept that and stop being offended by every berkeleying thing that isn't painted the right shade of special.
I
Jamie Foxx used the term "Recreationally Offended" on Joe Rogan's show.
He made the point that people are getting offended at things that, in the grand scheme of everything, really don't matter all that much.
He used the example of people getting mad at Robert Downey Jr. in blackface in Tropic Thunder. The argument was that people are getting upset with the entertainment but they're not getting upset with the genuine racists out there who actually want to do real harm to others.
In other words, "picking the low hanging fruit".
If GarageGorrila wasn't gone he could use this thread to explain himself.
BlindPirate said:If GarageGorrila wasn't gone he could use this thread to explain himself.
He was someone looking to cause a fight much the same way everyone we're talking about has been doing. Good chance we aren't even close to the first place he's been banned from. He's looking for someone to agree with him so he doesn't have to be wrong.
We need to be careful. We might give mob a bad name.
We classify Shiny Happy People as an Invasive Species! Sometimes an overwhelming and united response is the best answer. Our little town answered a complaint about smoke with a ban on burning certain types of trash. One person felt this was the inch needed to take a mile. Root of the problem was a boy that discovered that if he claimed to smell smoke it made it hard for him to breathe and he could play video games rather than do chores or homework or whatever.
Bruce
Appleseed said:We need to be careful. We might give mob a bad name.
What! You don’t get to decide what’s a bad name!!!
I think in regards to the situations in the original post, but also lots of other stuff i'm seeing going on, people have a deep seated desire to feel like they are an oppressed minority being victimized by an evil entity.
Vegan smells a grill, "They are doing this on purpose! They hate me because Im vegan!"
Griller gets asked to stop, "The vegans hate us, and they are trying to take away our tradition and destroy our culture!"
Of course they can get 4000 people to their bbq if those 4000 people have a steady diet of the right propaganda over the last decade of how vegans want to get you.
People berkeleying love to be oppressed. They gobble that E36 M3 up. And the smart organizations sell you your oppression by the truckload.
SEMA: "The government is gonna make it illegal to modify cars!!!! They hate us and everything we stand for!!!!! They want to destroy our culture and traditions!!!!!!! Only we can stop them!!!!!! Give us money to help fight the good fight!"
NRA: "Same! But about guns!!!!
Religious groups: "Same! But its the gays and athiests that are gonna get us!!!!!"
Atheists: "Same! But its the religious people that are gonna get us!!!!"
The list could go on for a looooooong time. But stop and think about what you see and hear in the media, specifically social media, cable news, internet forums and talk radio. How much of it is actual big stories that are really important, and how much of it is non-issues that are designed to to really get the blood pumping to your us-vs-them rage boner? Its a smorgasbord of propaganda out there. Rally around our team because the evil "them" is ready to pounce.
Now stop and think about what youve actually seen in the real world. Ever had a vegan smack a cheeseburger out of your hand? Ever had an immigrant steal your job? Ever had antifa throw a rock at you? Or been told youre not allowed to breast feed? Or been told you cant go to church, or have to go to church, or your church has to host a pride parade? Or any other damn thing im supposed to believe is the next big injustice waiting right around the corner for me? I bet not. Im not saying none of these things have never happened, im saying they almost never happen, and anybody that tells you it is a major epidemic is trying to manipulate you. So step back from the propaganda machine, and go have a beer with your neighbor. Theyre good people, just different.
In reply to gearheadmb :
Hot Rodders: "Anyone who drives a prius is a hater of cars, speed and fun. They're all gonna ban V8s."
Wait...
In reply to gearheadmb :
I have been yelled at by a Prius driver for driving her truck. I have had an anti-caucasian group fabricate an email and facebook post and send it to my employer. I have had a lady notice that I was concealed carrying and scream at me that I was a baby killer. I've listened to evangelical aethesists telling me how there is no god and evangelical "christians" telling me I'm going to hell because I don't go to church.
So yeah.... theres plenty of stupid and angry people out there.
In reply to gearheadmb :
um you might want to move to DC. You'd get a lot of affirmatives to what you have come to believe are rhetorical questions. But in flyover country - sure it's peachy out there.
I think part of it is some people have had enough and are starting to fight back. The screeching NIMBYs in my city have enjoyed years of getting their way because they yell the loudest and intimidate people into backing down. Well, in the last year or two people have started calling them on their B.S. and confronting them in public. People who used to just sit and watch are now standing up to call out the B.S. It seems to have really shocked a few of the main instigators who are now playing the victims.
Something snapped around here at least and it has been interesting to watch. The middle ground has disappeared and everyone has moved to one side, with little interest in compromise.
I think there's too many people that get off on trying to offend others. It's practically been fetishized by some - they try so hard to offend everyone by any means, and the second anyone pushes back against them they scream idiotic crap like "man you can't say anything these days, everyone gets so offended!" No, you're just being a shiny happy person. And anyone that has worked in customer service in the past 10 years would probably agree that boomers are the absolute worst.
I feel like people just want a reason to be angry these days. I don't know if its worldwide or just an American thing, but we're angry at everything and always looking for a finger to point at someone. I wish people had compassion. Instead, they ridicule people that have compassion. As I get older I find myself more and more tired of humanity. I just want to play my guitar and drive my car and listen to music.
Also I think social media is partially responsible. Many people, both old and young, have forgotten what it's like to be punched when they ran their mouths. They immediately throw out insults when they see someone with different politics, religious views, or what have you. Everything is polarized, everything is someone else's fault, no one thinks for themselves, and people get a tribal mentality.
I just thought of a counter-culture action that I think is absolutely lovely and wonderful, just to bring something good to this thread. The "hacker group" Anonymous has recent years made a habit of hacking social media accounts used for ISIS recruitment and filling them with soft gay porn. Nothing graphic, just hunks hugging and kissing, you know.
This still makes me smile just thinking about it.
infinitenexus said:I feel like people just want a reason to be angry these days. I don't know if its worldwide or just an American thing, but we're angry at everything and always looking for a finger to point at someone.
It's not just these days. At least 20 years ago I remember seeing a Time or Newsweek magazine cover with CRYBABIES AND TATTLETALES - The Death of American Culture or something very similar to that as the lead article.
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