Woodworking advice needed: Building a wooden dash?

OK GRM Hive Mind, I need some wood finishing advice.

I'm going to build a wooden dash patterned after this one in a Datsun Type 12. 

I don't have much of a woodworking background, but the shape is simple, so I'm going to give it a try.  The wood I'll use is oak (part of a futon someone trashed) and I'd really like some advice on the best way to finish the wood.   This two part epoxy stuff is available at Lowe's and looks really nice on the counter they made with it.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Famowood-Glaze-Coat-32-oz-Gloss-Oil-Based-Lacquer/3151089

I guess it is a finish often used on bar counter tops.  Any ideas how this holds up?  What would you guys use if you were building a VERY flat wooden dash.  How would you finish it?

BTW, the car has an odd history.  It is the one in Nissan's Heritage Garage facility in Zama, and for years they called it a 1932 Type 11.  After a restoration they decided that it is a 1933 Type 12.   The major difference between the two is supposed to be displacement, with the Type 11 having a 500 cc displacement, and the Type 12 having 750 cc displacement.

I would(and am planning to use on my wood dash on the Devin Panhard restoration) use an outdoor spar urethane like for house doors and stuff.  I know it holds up well from experience, I have a redwood door on my house and didn’t bother putting a storm door on it for 5 years 

Patrick said:

I would(and am planning to use on my wood dash on the Devin Panhard restoration) use an outdoor spar urethane like for house doors and stuff.  I know it holds up well 

So, something like this?

https://www.amazon.com/Minwax-63200444-Helmsman-Urethane-quart/dp/B000Y4II3I/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1515556080&sr=8-2&keywords=spar+urethane

Are you going to stain first? You can and should do some test pieces before the real thing.

Also, sand sand sand sand. And layer layer layer layer. That is how you finish wood.

West systems.  Their specialty is marine, so lots of harsh environment and UV exposure. That said, any clear epoxy has some UV susceptibility. You could use a clear, very thin 2-part to seal the wood, then a marine spar varnish over it to protect from the UV.  It's harder and more expensive, but probably the best.

Robbie said:

Are you going to stain first? You can and should do some test pieces before the real thing.

Also, sand sand sand sand. And layer layer layer layer. That is how you finish wood.

also, this.

Robbie said:

Are you going to stain first? You can and should do some test pieces before the real thing.

Yes, I plan to stain it.  I want it to look very similar to the original car's dash, so probably a light brown with hints of orange.  That futon provided plenty of wood to do test pieces.  The dash is only 8.5" high and 46" wide.

Robbie said:

Also, sand sand sand sand. And layer layer layer layer. That is how you finish wood.

This makes sense.  

epoxy does not do well when exposed to ultraviolet radiation, like you would get from the sun. You can varnish over it to protect it (or a clear coat) but that kind of defeats the purpose of the epoxy. Petit, who does a lot of marine varnishes, just came out with a very nice water based formula called "Sea gold" that seems to have some nice properties. It's also a little forgiving of brush strokes

Were it me I would use Tru-oil

Easy to apply. Can go from a thin satin to a glossy clear depending on applications.  Inexpensive too 

Jumper K Balls said:

Were it me I would use Tru-oil

Easy to apply. Can go from a thin satin to a glossy clear depending on applications.  Inexpensive too 

I've used Linseed oil on a boat deck before.  Is this similar?  How would it hold up in a convertible?

the problem with linseed oil, it is an organic. Eventually it turns the wood black

JoeyM said:

Patrick said:

I would(and am planning to use on my wood dash on the Devin Panhard restoration) use an outdoor spar urethane like for house doors and stuff.  I know it holds up well 

So, something like this?

https://www.amazon.com/Minwax-63200444-Helmsman-Urethane-quart/dp/B000Y4II3I/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1515556080&sr=8-2&keywords=spar+urethane

Yes i buy that stuff by the gallon 

Only other thing I'd add to make sure you seal/finish both side of the dash so moisture absorption is equal which should hopefully limit warping.

FWIW, warp-resistance is why older Triumph dashes (like my Spitfire and GT6) use plywood rather than solid wood as they are inherently more stable.  Aftermarket replacement dashes made from solid wood are typically finished on both sides for this reason. Personally I would rather a fancy veneer over  low-void plywood.

you could always skip the veneer and get a nice plywood to begin with. Sapele comes out nicely when varnished

JoeyM said:

Jumper K Balls said:

Were it me I would use Tru-oil

 

Easy to apply. Can go from a thin satin to a glossy clear depending on applications.  Inexpensive too 

I've used Linseed oil on a boat deck before.  Is this similar?  How would it hold up in a convertible?

 

 

Tru-oil is a gun stock finish and as such is intended to be handled.  It is more of a hand rubbed lacquer than an oil like linseed.

Ian F said:

Only other thing I'd add to make sure you seal/finish both side of the dash so moisture absorption is equal which should hopefully limit warping.

This is good advice

FWIW, warp-resistance is why older Triumph dashes (like my Spitfire and GT6) use plywood rather than solid wood as they are inherently more stable.

So a solid oak futon from the neighbor's trash may not be the correct thing to make a dash out of?  Next you will be telling me I shouldn't have been making the car's body panels out of their upright freezers, ovens and washing machines.  

Is gunstock oil water resistant? UV stable?

dculberson said:

Is gunstock oil water resistant? UV stable?

That's a REALLY good question.  I can't imagine anyone leaving a wood-stock benelli outside with the amount of sun exposure a car's wooden dash will be getting

mad_machine said:

you could always skip the veneer and get a nice plywood to begin with. Sapele comes out nicely when varnished

 

That is beautiful.  I REALLY like it.  At this point, though, the "It was built out of other people's trash" talking point has almost gotten bigger than the "replica of early datsun" talking point.....I almost feel *obligated* to use the oak from the futon.

In reply to JoeyM :

It depends more on how you are going to store it than anything else.  

First wood moves, a lot!  Unlike metal which expands and contracts with heat. Wood shrinks and swells with moisture.  30%or90% humidity will shrink or swell wood.  Inside during the winter in heated storage humidity can be under 10%.

Clear eurethanes are basically plastic and as such they Flex a little bit but over time ( like 3-4 years depend on where you are) they will peel and flake  to the point of loss. Then the UV light in sunlight will turn the wood grey and eventually black.  

Expoxies are really a two Part form of plastic that is really hard.  

Dont use oil!! It has almost zero weather protection. And needs to be reapplied frequently.  It’s only strength is just about anybody can do a decent oil rub.  

The wood boat crowd swears by  Epiphanes but then I notice wood Chris Crafts  getting sanded down and refinished every few years.  And Epiphanes is really proud of their varnish,  like insanely proud so they charge a lot of money for it.  Bring your loan officer if you’re thinking of buying some.   

I used Minwax’s Varithane on my timberframe house and it lasted a little over two years before noticeable fading started to occur in direct sunlite and shortly after that Black WALNUT TIMBERS started turning grey.

before doing your dash with anything stain it your  choice of color. White oak tends towards the yellow while red oak has a more reddish brown tinge to it.  Once the stain is on wipe it off  quickly, don’t let it dry according to instructions. And then give it a coat a clear two coats of shellac. When you mix your shellac use one part Shellac and two parts denatured alcohol. Nope nothing other than denatured alcohol. Trust me it matters.  The first coat dries insanely fast typically 15 min or less.  There speed is everything.  Wash it on. Don’t worry at all about mistakes or runs or anything.  Once dry the grain will be raised. You can feel those nubs sticking up.   sand them off with 320 grit paper  lightly block sand so you don’t go through the really thin coat.  Keep you fingers feeling for any nubs you may have missed. But don’t over sand  once nubs are gone put on the second coat

The second coat will melt into the first coat you can do the second in 15 minutes or 15 years or 150 years... they will melt together. The second coat takes twice as long to dry. When dry,  Feel it and make sure no nubs have been raised.  If you have to sand off nubs do the same as above. The third coat will melt into the first two coats but take twice as long as the last coat did. 

Don't obsess about gloss, yet  

That does two things.  First it helps seal the open pores and second really causes the grain to “POP” underneath whatever weather finish you select.  

JoeyM said:

So a solid oak futon from the neighbor's trash may not be the correct thing to make a dash out of?  Next you will be telling me I shouldn't have been making the car's body panels out of their upright freezers, ovens and washing machines.  

I didn't say that - I've seen a number of Spitfire dashes made from solid wood.  It can work fine if you account for it. Being a fairly cheap production car, the back-side of Triumph dash panels are unfinished and don't even appear to be sealed. Hell... they're barely sanded... 

If the dash will generally be out of the weather (will the car eventually get a top?), then I don't think you need to go crazy with the finish. However, if you think there's a chance the dash will get wet while in use, then an exterior grade weather-proof poly might be a good idea.

In reply to Ian F :

Since a dash is mostly gauges and controls etc with a little wood peaking out here or there brush painting is extremely difficult to do with thick clear finishes. Brush marks and runs show up in the worst possible places unless you are extremely skilled or have great natural talent.  

Spraying usually results in better appearance.  Here’s a wonderful place for spray cans. 

Ian F said:

JoeyM said:

So a solid oak futon from the neighbor's trash may not be the correct thing to make a dash out of?  Next you will be telling me I shouldn't have been making the car's body panels out of their upright freezers, ovens and washing machines.  

I didn't say that -

I know you didn't.  It was just my attempt to say something funny enough to get quoted in Say What like all the cool kids.  Of course, now that I reveal this, it will never happen.  

Ian F said:

If the dash will generally be out of the weather (will the car eventually get a top?), then I don't think you need to go crazy with the finish. However, if you think there's a chance the dash will get wet while in use, then an exterior grade weather-proof poly might be a good idea.

Yes, it will eventually get a convertible top (hopefully in a light tan color similar to the real Type 11/Type 12 car), but I do expect that it will occasionally have small amounts of rain on the dash.   The plan is for it to be a garage kept, sunny day car, but this is FL, and "sunny day" is a statement that only has any meaning for the next 10-20 minutes

frenchyd said:

In reply to Ian F :

Since a dash is mostly gauges and controls etc with a little wood peaking out here or there brush painting is extremely difficult to do with thick clear finishes. Brush marks and runs show up in the worst possible places unless you are extremely skilled or have great natural talent.  

Spraying usually results in better appearance.  Here’s a wonderful place for spray cans. 

The link didn't show.   Please post it again.  I'm interested in seeing what you'd use.