Wuhan

dculberson said:

mtn said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the fear here that it is taking down otherwise healthy people? I'm not sure that the comparisons to influenza are the best. 

The 1918 Flu took down otherwise healthy people in large numbers. They think it caused cytokine storms which is a very cool name but not a good thing to experience. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cytokine_release_syndrome Note the article says they have similar suspicions about SARS so it might be related to this one too.

I guess my point though is that other than the 1918 Flu, we haven't really seen that since - a common virus taking out otherwise healthy people. Generally the flu deaths that are reported are, I believe (I could be wrong), mostly comprised of the very old, the very young, or the otherwise unhealthy. The Coronvirus is apparently much more similar to SARS or the 1918 Flu, in that it is taking out HEALTHY people. That is where it gets scary. 

Or maybe I'm completely wrong here and have things mixed up in my head.

Medscape sez:

According to WHO, serious cases in China have mostly been in people over 40 years old with significant comorbidities and have skewed towards men. Spread seems to be limited to family members, health care providers, and other close contacts, probably by respiratory droplets. If that pattern holds, WHO officials said, the outbreak is containable.

 

The fatality rate appears to be around 3%, a good deal lower than the 10% reported for SARS and much lower than the nearly 40% reported for Middle East respiratory syndrome (MERS), another recent coronavirus mutation from the animal trade.

 

The Wuhan virus fatality rate might drop as milder cases are detected and added to the denominator. "It definitely appears to be less severe than SARS and MERS," said Amesh Adalja, MD, an infectious disease physician in Pittsburgh and emerging infectious disease researcher at Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore.

 

SARS: Lessons Learned

In general, the world is much better equipped for coronavirus outbreaks than when SARS, in particular, emerged in 2003.

 

WHO officials in their press conference lauded China for it openness with the current outbreak, and for isolating and sequencing the virus immediately, which gave the world a diagnostic test in the first days of the outbreak, something that wasn't available for SARS. China and other countries also are cooperating and working closely to contain the Wuhan virus.

 

"What we know today might change tomorrow, so we have to keep tuned in to new information, but we learned a lot from SARS," Dr. Shaffner said. Overall, it's likely "the impact on the United States of this new coronavirus is going to be trivial," he predicted.

 

Dr. Lucey, however, recalled that the SARS outbreak in Toronto in 2003 started with one missed case. A woman returned asymptomatic from Hong Kong and spread the infection to her family members before she died. Her cause of death wasn't immediately recognized, nor was the reason her family members were sick, since they hadn't been to Hong Kong recently.

 

The infection ultimately spread to more than 200 people, about half of them health care workers. A few people died.

 

If a virus is sufficiently contagious, "it just takes one. You don't want to be the one who misses that first patient," Dr. Lucey said.

mtn said:

So am I wrong about that with the Cornoavirus that it attacks and kills otherwise young and reasonably healthy people?

I was under the impression it was mostly older people and people with compromised immune systems.

93EXCivic said:

mtn said:

So am I wrong about that with the Cornoavirus that it attacks and kills otherwise young and reasonably healthy people?

I was under the impression it was mostly older people and people with compromised immune systems.

That's the part that scares me............girlfriend has RA and is on immunosuppresant drugs. 

WHO (World Health Organization) has now declared a global emergency over the virus outbreak.

link to AP story

Let's hope this is just an over-reaction on their part and they get this under control soon.

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/harvard-university-professor-and-two-chinese-nationals-charged-three-separate-china-related

Uhh, am I reading this right? We have a Harvard professor versed in chemistry and chemistry biology taking huge money from the Chinese and helping set up a research lab in WUHAN and covering it all up, one "research assistant" who failed to disclose she's a lieutenant in the People's Liberation Army and a member of the Chinese Communist Part, and another "research assistant" who got nabbed by the FBI trying to hitch a flight to China with biological samples. All shortly before this kicked off. That's way too many coincidences, right? Guys, I've read this Tom Clancy novel before.

Apparently China has started to arrest people who discuss the outbreak's containment procedures in a negative light.

Indy-Guy said:

WHO (World Health Organization) has now declared a global emergency over the virus outbreak.

link to AP story

Let's hope this is just an over-reaction on their part and they get this under control soon.

Hopefully an over-abundance of caution.

The large German conglomerate I work for just sent out an email banning all travel to or from China unless it's for "business critical" reasons, and they say if you've been to China in the past few weeks, you should stay away from the office for a while.

Mr_Asa said:

Apparently China has started to arrest people who discuss the outbreak's containment procedures in a negative light.

That's the normal Chinese response to anything though.
 

In reply to Mr_Asa :

Once again The Onion has a story first:

https://www.theonion.com/xi-jinping-vows-to-combat-coronavirus-by-making-it-ille-1841274319

The Onion must have been cursed in the Greek God way, able to see into the future but doomed to speak about it only in attempted satire.

Or-that those at The Onion see the world as it is, while the rest of us see the world as we would like it to be.  Either way, we're all screwed..  

From the CDC:

Health care providers should obtain a detailed travel history for patients being evaluated with fever
and acute respiratory illness. ADH recommends asking about any travel to China in the last 14 days.
Patients in the United States who meet the following criteria should be evaluated as a Person Under
Investigation (PUI) in association with the outbreak of 2019-nCoV in China:
1) Fever OR signs/symptoms of lower respiratory illness (e.g., cough, shortness of breath)
–AND any person, including health care workers, who has had close contact with a laboratoryconfirmed
2019-nCoV patient within 14 days of symptom onset.
2) Fever AND signs/symptoms of lower respiratory illness (e.g., cough, shortness of breath)
–AND a history of travel from Hubei Province, China within 14 days of symptom onset.
3) Fever AND signs/symptoms of lower respiratory illness (e.g., cough, shortness of breath) requiring
hospitalization,
–AND a history of travel from mainland China within 14 days of symptom onset.
The above criteria are also available at https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nCoV/clinicalcriteria.
html. These criteria are intended to serve as guidance for evaluation. Patients should be
evaluated and discussed with the Arkansas Department of Health (ADH) on a case-by-case basis. We
also want to emphasize that clinicians should also, at the same time, proceed with normally indicated
testing for pneumonia or similar respiratory infections (influenza, multiplex respiratory panel, CXR,
etc.) We have also included a 1-page job aid for clinicians to help with first steps that can also be found
at https://www.healthy.arkansas.gov/images/uploads/pdf/Job_Aid_for_Clinicians1.31.20.pdf

I've never seen them react like this.  It's "interesting."  Makes you wonder if they didn't steal a virus, mod it up in the bats at that level 4 lab 20 miles away from the Bat Soup Market, have a bat or person accidentally get loose with the infection and Whoopsie.  And I'm sure that ad they had up wanting a grad student corona virus researcher with bat experience was just purely coincidental.

And this is "interesting" also:

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/coronavirus-contains-hiv-insertions-stoking-fears-over-artificially-created-bioweapon

In reply to Dr. Hess :

So at what point in the outbreak do you lock yourself inside & don't open any doors or windows? 

In reply to Pete Gossett :

For the most part, I don't think it would do any good.  But, if you really want to do that, I would wait until your local town has bodies piling up like cord wood.  That would be a good time to isolate yourself. 

Dr. Hess said:

In reply to Pete Gossett :

For the most part, I don't think it would do any good.  But, if you really want to do that, I would wait until your local town has bodies piling up like cord wood.  That would be a good time to isolate yourself. 

As contagious as it seems to be, you're probably right. Last I'd heard they still hadn't determined if it was transmittable before symptoms appeared. If it is, that's a bit of a problem. 

I think they pretty much have determined it is transmittable prior to symptoms showing up.  So, yeah, that's a bit of an issue. I've been following it in the medical world.  A plane came in from China.  They redirected it to an AFB and put the whole lot of them into quarantine.  This is quite different than what the previous administration did with the various infections that came through, like Ebola.  Then it was, "oh, no, you can't stop people from coming in or quarantine them, that would be 'ray-sis.'  Better we all die instead."  This time, it's "F' that.  Put them all in quarantine for 2 weeks until we see they are not infected."  Now, why?  Is it just that we learned from the Ebola thing?  Ebola also doesn't seem to be THAT much of a communicable disease, as long as you don't dig up your dead relatives and have a party with them, then stick them back in the ground.  Really, that's what they were doing in Africa.  Or is it that the current administration wants to protect our country more and doesn't care about being called little names?  Or is it that this virus is "different" and may actually be a very bad thing?  If that HIV code is really in it like the Indians say, that is, their study is repeatable or confirmed otherwise, then it would appear that someone made this one "special."  No other corona virus has HIV code in it.  It didn't just "evolve" specific RNA code just like HIV has for packaging and attachment.  The Chinese are also using HIV antivirals to treat it, according to main stream media reports.

On the plus side, there are reports that the thing is mutating rapidly.  That's good news, as these things generally mutate to be less deadly.  And, it only seems to be killing like 4% of those infected, hasn't killed anyone outside of China yet (although person to person infection has occurred outside of China) and compared to influenza, it is a minor inconvenience if you just go by the published death numbers of a few hundred.  I mean, we've had close to 30 dead in Arkansas alone this flu season.  So 200 dead from some other virus all over the world is pretty minor by comparison.  Again, why the big reaction?

I put Zerohedge as only slightly more reliable than Worldnetdaily.

Dr. Hess said:

This is quite different than what the previous administration did with the various infections that came through, like Ebola.  Then it was, "oh, no, you can't stop people from coming in or quarantine them, that would be 'ray-sis.'  Better we all die instead." 

yet here we are, most decidedly not all dead. 

The 200 people  that are in "Corona Prison"  are at the old Air Force base by where Riverside Raceway was , about 30 miles from the City of Corona California.

They all worked for the US government in Wuhan or were family , 

It was a special flight , 

I am not sure they could get away with doing this to a Delta or United flight .

We will see Sunday how many people are grabbed that were in China and try to enter the USA with the travel ban , I am not sure if they announced if they will just send them back , or quarantine them in the USA.

And how many face masks will we see at the Super Bowl Sunday ?

AngryCorvair said:

Dr. Hess said:

This is quite different than what the previous administration did with the various infections that came through, like Ebola.  Then it was, "oh, no, you can't stop people from coming in or quarantine them, that would be 'ray-sis.'  Better we all die instead." 

yet here we are, most decidedly not all dead. 

I agree.  The Ebola response was out of proportion as well.  But the reasons given for not addressing the problem more aggressively were BS.