Cheapest 0 to Nurburgring?

I have this long running desire to actually drive the Nurburgring. The public north track. I understand you want some sim time because of the complexity of the track. My PC is a real lightweight that barely handles Portal. I don't own a console, save an old Atari 2600. Any suggestions for a title/platform?

GT3 or 4 (I forget which one) on the ps2. Oh and a ps2.

Are PS3s still meaningfully more expensive than PS2s used?

I can't speak to anything else, but GT5 on a PS3 helped, though it's astonishing how different it feels in real life.

Just as in the game, the latter half of the course is much harder to recognize and memorize. There's just so much track...

If you can find a cheap PS3, there a BUNCH of GT5 discs out there that I am sure you could get for super cheap or free. I suspect at least a few people in the GT6 league would probably just give you theirs. There really is not much use for them now that GT6 is out.

Let us know if you go that way and were you are, there may even be someone local.

There of course are a lot of videos out there that could help also. There are at least a few tricky turns in it (and it's a pretty narrow course), so getting familiar with it is certainly a good idea.

Cheap ps3 and GT5 is probably the best.

Forza Motorsports 4 and an XBox 360.

i'd be happy to send you my copy of GT5 for PS3 if you source one.

Honestly? Don't try to learn it. The accidents happen when people think they know it and come piling into a second gear corner expecting it to be a fourth gear one. It's not like learning a 2.5 mile track with a dozen corners.

In reply to Keith Tanner:

I have to disagree... Well, in part.

Absolutely I agree that you'd be a fool to go in with any belief that you know the place.

But my time with GT5 allowed me to confirm that I really did recognize a few corners after the first couple of laps, when they were consistently what I thought they were... (EDIT: I mean once I'd driven a couple of laps of the actual track, there were a few corners that I had immediately and correctly recognized from the sim. There was also a clear majority of the track which I would not have bet $20 -let alone my health or my rental Swift- that I had right)

The rest of your background may also apply. I've been autocrossing for a long time, but had only done one other track day, so even if I knew the place cold I wasn't going to be driving it with the same intensity as someone with more seat time. So maybe someone with a higher comfort level would have been in more danger of thinking they knew what they were doing...

Maybe I'm a bigger scaredy-cat than the average enthusiast, but one of my first and firmest impressions upon getting on track there was how much different it felt than in GT5. Being there makes vivid how different what you're doing is from your PS3 seat time. The Gs at the bottom of Fuchsröhre somehow never came across in my living room...

Clearly people get in over their heads there quite often, but I still think pre-familiarizing yourself can add to the experience as long as you're cautious and don't put too much stock in your virtual education.

I've been playing Forza 4 every night on Xbox 360 for the same reason.

Isnt Forza's version of the 'Ring wider than the real track? I know I at least hear a lot of people complaining about that over the years.

I know it seems wider than the track in GT.

Ive never been there so I dont know.

In reply to failboat:

I know that in reality it feels narrower than it feels in GT5...

I did it backwards - there weren't any simulations available when I drove the track. I do remember my German friends warning about lap 3, that's about the time you think you know what you're doing and you crash I found out about Fuchsröhre by driving it, that was probably the most memorable corner on the track. At the time, I had autox experience but little track experience.

I've driven the track in simulation since, and years later I still remember some sections from real life. But I also find the corners I remember are usually separated by a few I don't.

I still think that trying to learn the track is only going to lead to problems. It's fun to do, but it can only lead to problems on the Green Hell.

There's a free sim called "Racer," (http://racer.nl) I remember there are a lot more addons supported in an older version than the latest, it's pretty barebones when you install it with 1 car and 1 track...anyway it's free and you can get the Nordschleife addon and some cars for it.

Graphics requirements vary depending on what addons you're using but in general they're pretty light.

Edit: But yeah I could see virtual overconfidence leading to physical danger. If it were most other tracks I wouldn't be worried, but most other tracks have meaningful amounts of runoff room and a complete lack of "rustic" track design.

In reply to failboat:

Yeah, Forza's version is too wide and far too smooth. GT has done a far better job of re-creating the 'Ring for us couch racing types.

Its a shame, because I greatly prefer Forza's physics to GT's, but I love running laps on GT6's version. Forza 5 STILL has no 'Ring, but its rumored to be released in a couple months.

I find it exactly the opposite. GT is billiard table smooth, but does a really good job of simulating elevation change. The very limited suspension 'program' (with that many cars, something has to be trimmed to make it all fit on the disc) of GT makes it feel bumpy at times.

I know from running Daytona that it's nowhere as smooth as GT makes it out to be. It's better since the re-pave, but GT5 is not even close.

I'll try racer.nl first. It does look pretty lightweight. If that doesn't work, I'll go with a PS3 I guess. I appreciate all of the advice to avoid a false sense of familiarity and orientation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CDxTIYEBuc

Here's a little comparison video, by a guy who can't drive a lick. Watch how easily the 458 is to pitch and catch in GT5 (the first half of the video) vs. how you actually have to get the corner right or get off the gas and gather it back up in Forza. The sound is off somehow, in the Forza 4 part of the vid, but you still get the idea.

Hmm... I may be missing something: It would be sopmehow safer to go into the Green Hell oblivious to each section of the track than it would be to learn all 145 or so turns via sim racers?

If overconfidence is the worry, then build a 750+ HP US Muscle Car with stock everything else (tires, brakes, suspension) and spend a few dozen hours trying to get a clean sub-ten minute lap on FM4. There's no way you'll be able to take a 2nd gear turn in 4th in a 800HP Olds 442 in Forza.

In reply to Flyin Mikey J:

I don't think the concern was that you'd learn that turn X was a 4th gear corner in GT6 and then try it in 4th in real life. The concern is that with 145 corners you will not accurately learn the whole track, but if you think you have, you may pick the 4th gear entry speed for turn X, but actually be going into turn Y, which is a decreasing-radius monster which will put you in the armco for it.

While I do think I benefited from GT5, I'm also a giant fraidy-cat, and probably never drove remotely as fast as a more experienced track day person would have if they had never seen the course and were driving it like an unfamiliar road, with speeds based only on what they could see.

I actually feel that the GT5/6 simulations of the ring to be rather accurate. Yes they can't simulate the little bumps or leaves or sections where water seeps through the cracks but they get most of it right.

I actually felt that the sim feels narrower than the real track. My BMW 320i seemed to have more room to play with. But what I found the most different is the traffic. Guys who visit every open day with their Chrysler GLHs since they bought it will pass you in spots that have you screaming "No not here!!" Then you realize that they CAN take the corner at twice your speed. Then around the next bend over a blind crest you find a full on tour bus.

Unless you are at a closed track day you will need to focus on situational awareness of traffic and only when you have clear sight can you push it.

I found that trying to follow the ring taxis to be the best as they seem to know when to be cautious versus all out.