Longest Lasting Bike Engines

Who makes the longest lasting bike motors? It seems that Japanese bike motors are pretty tired after about 20k, but there are tons of BMW's with over 70k on a motor. Why is this?

I would think it depends on which Japanese bike motor. Some don't last that long, others last fine.

BMWs usually make less power than Japanese bikes of comparable displacement, plus most BMW riders tend to look after their fairly expensive bikes rather well.

For pure longevity I think the BMW K bricks are hard to beat, there are a bunch of them around with over an 250k on them and one of my K75 winter hacks had over 100k on it and still ran fine.

Goldwings are known to rack up a lot of miles. Triumph triples can do some decent mileage too - unless they fall into the hands of a squid.

Joshua wrote: Who makes the longest lasting bike motors? It seems that Japanese bike motors are pretty tired after about 20k, but there are tons of BMW's with over 70k on a motor. Why is this?

I have 43K on my 600 bandit and it runs just fine.

Harleys can go 80-100K+ on a build.

ST_ZX2 wrote: Harleys can go 80-100K+ on a build.

That sounds like a challenge.

There's a couple of XS650's with over 100k on them owned by members of XS650.com and a whole bunch in the 50-75k range. The big mile bikes all have one thing in common: daily (or nearly daily) use coupled with good maintenance. The odo on mine was showing ~17k when i got it, but it had been disassembled for use in a gokart and had been sitting that way for several years, the motor ran good when I fired it up. If it hadn't had an oil leak from the head gasket (happens if the head nuts are loosened, done by the go kart boys) I probably would have ridden it for a while as is. Idid discover that as a result of sitting outside with the carbs off, the right cylinder had water damage. Stuck a 'big fin' cylinder/piston set on it, some new cam chain guides and new gaskets etc as needed, the bottom end has never been apart.

ST_ZX2 wrote: Harleys can go 80-100K+ on a build.

And AK47's can fire packed with sand. I prefer tighter tolerances and modern technology.

1todd /cite>

ST_ZX2 wrote: Harleys can go 80-100K+ on a build.

And AK47's can fire packed with sand. I prefer tighter tolerances and modern technology.

I take big mother berkeleying offense to that. You see, I make parts for Harley-Davidson, and the tolerances are pretty berkeleying tight.

The "modern technology" gripe is getting old, too.

RealMiniDriver wrote:

1todd /cite>

ST_ZX2 wrote: Harleys can go 80-100K+ on a build.

And AK47's can fire packed with sand. I prefer tighter tolerances and modern technology.

I take big mother berkeleying offense to that. You see, I make parts for Harley-Davidson, and the tolerances are pretty berkeleying tight. The "modern technology" gripe is getting old, too.

I was wondering if the "old fight" would arise

Just kidding.

My gripe is Harley and their litigious business practices, overpricing of their product, lack of support for their true base clientele and the typical new Harley owner that thinks 25 grand and 25 miles makes them a biker.

My late brother who was a Harley mech put tens of thousands of miles on his AMF era shovel (XLS 1000) and swore that, when properly maintained, he would put it up against any EVO. Plenty of miles per smiles and dollars per fun. How being a biker is supposed to be! Cheap! Remember, it used to be about surplus WLA's and police auction hardtails. . .

I think the intended RPM range for a motor has a large effect. 600cc sportbikes that will rev to 15K+ obviously won't last as long as a 'Wing cruising down the highway at 3k...And Harley's at 300 or so lol. I KEEEED

My CX500 has 68,000 on it and I keep hearing stories of them hitting 200K plus.

I realise HD uses modern technology and all that but how long did it take them to adopt unit construction?

Shawn

RealMiniDriver wrote:

ST_ZX2 wrote: Harleys can go 80-100K+ on a build.

That sounds like a challenge.

Yeah, I'm not saying it hasn't happened. I haven't seen it seen it though, and haven't heard that story from anyone I know that has one. Most I have heard of is 60K.

And I worked at a motorcycle shop for a few years.

Yeah the CX500 seems to last a while in the Jap lineup. BMWs are traditionally seen with high mileage.

Triumph, sucks. I haven't seen a 3cylinder triumph with more than 40K without a rebuild.

People bash on Harley but the 90s Triumphs seem to be a big piles or crap-ola.

I've always heard Harley's are like that...

So it greatly depends on what the bike is used for I guess.

How about Italian stuff? How does it compare to BMW or Triumph etc. I have seen a Ducati track bike with 29k on a motor but it in need of a rebuild.

I had a ducati and put 20K on it. No issues, but I did the maintenance, which I think cost more than it costs to rebuild the Harley! LOL

I understand the new Desmo valvetrain is much better. They no longer require a valve check when you change the oil.

I talked to a guy with an older harley once, I asked him how many miles, he said 350k, how many rebuilds, he said 4. I'd say a harley in good condition should be good for between 60-75k miles before needing a top end job and maybe a piston/ring. They aren't as bad as people make them out to be.

People talk about harley using ancient design but I guess decati and motoguzzi get a pass because they are fancy pance european. Why does ducati still make bikes with desmo valves?

Joshua wrote: Who makes the longest lasting bike motors? It seems that Japanese bike motors are pretty tired after about 20k, but there are tons of BMW's with over 70k on a motor. Why is this?

Maintenance mostly. And some large quantities of over reving.

I took my V4 Magna to nearly 80k by the time I sold it, and it was doing just fine. Regular oil changes and respecting the redline.

benzbaronDaryn wrote: Why does ducati still make bikes with desmo valves?

The thought is more stable at higher RPMs. Before everyone lists the latest Japanese sport bike turning 9x10^23 RPM, this was developed before we had the metallurgical technology and materials processing controls we have available today.

Springs used to break and not be that reliable. Not to mention rob power because the high rates required to turn high RPMs and prevent valve float. It really is a design way ahead of it's time. I would only put solenoid operated valve system above it in the terms of valve tech.

Ducati's propaganda on the subject:

"Ducati riders share a secret. It’s called Desmodromic valve control. An engineering solution found on only one motorcycle – Ducati. Most motorcycle engines rely upon conventional springs for valve closure, but as rpm increases, the time taken for the spring to close the valve becomes critical. Failure of the valve to follow the precise profile of the camshaft results in loss of perfo rmance. Ducati's Desmodromic valve system eliminates the spring and actuates valve closure mechanically. The result is safe, exact valve timing at all engine speeds. Every Ducati motorcycle, including our World Superbikes and the MotoGP Desmosedicis rely on the Desmo system."

Why does ducati still make bikes with desmo valves?

Because they are so cool!

You can make some really interesting configurations with it too. Look at this linkie:

http://www.pattakon.com/pattakonDesmo.htm

In my experience, the CX500 V-Twin will last forever with nothing but gas and oil.

In reply to foxtrapper:

You hit the nails on the head foxtrapper.

Maintenence: Bikes needs to be maintained every bit as much (if not more) as a car. High quality oil that is changed on schedule is critical, especially with air-cooled engine. On older bikes, having a properly function carb or crabs (properly synched) can go a long way to enhancing reliability. With newer bikes with fuel injection, keep injectors clean.

Rev Limit: Just because a bike can rev to the stratosphere, does not mean that you have to do it all day long. I realize that some bikes are tuned to perform best at high RPMs and that lugging an engine can be damaging, but engines shoujld be operated in that "happy" zone, above lug, but not screaming.

My GT380 makes most of its power above 6,000 (and I will vist that area when accelerating from time to time (max power is 7500 and redline is 8000). However, most of the time I am between 3500 and 5500. My CB450 makes max power around 9000 with a 9500 redline. It begins really building power around 6000. Good cruise rpms are in the 3500 to 5500 range as well. Heat is an enemy with bith of my bikes as well. Keep them cool.

Small bore engines tend to work harder, don't expect as many miles from them if you are rinding long distances at high rpms.. Just my experience ando observations.

A friend has a Harley (I think with the Evo engine) with well over 100,000 miles on it, still running fine as far as I know. I recently looked at a used Gold Wing that had 140,000 on it.

Joshua wrote: Who makes the longest lasting bike motors? It seems that Japanese bike motors are pretty tired after about 20k, but there are tons of BMW's with over 70k on a motor. Why is this?

I've never had/ridden a Japanese bike that was tired from mileage. As a group, they are probably the best made and most reliable bikes. They're just cheaper, and get treated as disposable. I'd say the fact that they can last 20k+ miles without any kind of tuneup is a testament to how sturdy most of them are.

I'd also say that it's perfectly fine to redline them fairly often. They're designed for it. The issue comes in when SquiddyBob thinks it's ok to ride around in first gear at redline to make noise, or downshifts too high to make more noise.

I'll go one further and say that Honda>ALL in terms of quality and reliability.