Polaris Industries, a US-based maker of all-terrain and other specialised vehicles, aims to challenge Harley Davidson’s dominance of the heavy cruiser motorcycle market by buying Indian Motorcycle.
Polaris plans to combine Indian with its own 13-year-old Victory bike brand to achieve improved economies of scale.
Supposedly they will still be standalone brands. Victory will remain, but Indian will be added.
I thought Indian motorcycle was a chain of clothing stores.
There have been a number of "Indian Motorcycle" company "revivals." They usually end spectacularly in FAIL. The last 2 or so have been Harley clones with aftermarket everything and some styling packages like the big fenders or nice leather saddlebags. It will be interesting to see if the Indian name kills off Polaris as well.
The problem is that if anyone is going to dump 35 large on a bike, it had better say "Harley-Davidson" on it.
Dr. Hess wrote: The problem is that if anyone is going to dump 35 large on a bike, they had better check into a nut house.
Fixed that for you.
I never really understood the Indian revivals. Each one has made them a Harley clone. My understanding is the Indian and Harley were pretty bitter rivals. The only way for Indian to survive is to look and sound different than a Harley. Otherwise, you get the real deal, or the Japanese knock off.
And better yet, design something new for Christsakes. Most of the people that can appreciate a throwback Indian design are already dead.
Indian and H-D shared basic engine architecture etc for a long time meaning there wasn't really a clear 'better' bike. H-D won out in the end due to their government contracts. Once Indian collapsed and the Wigwam was closed, the Indian name has been adrift for many years, passed around like a cheap hooker. One of the many Indian revivals was small dirt bikes with some kind of offshore engines.
The problem is that the Indian name has been 'dead' for such a long time very few people are interested in one no matter what. If Polaris does anything other than making Indian a niche player they will be screwed. They'd be better off building a line of no-E36 M3 sport and dirt bikes, at last there would be a North American manufacturer of serious performance equipment as opposed to potato potato cruisers. H-D obviously isn't going to do it.
A guy can dream, can't he?
From today's Minneapolis newspaper:
Polaris on Tuesday was unclear about its plans for Indian's offices and manufacturing facility in Kings Mountain, N.C., but in the conference call said it would close the operations. A Polaris spokeswoman said the operations have about 25 employees. Wine said some engineers and marketing employees will be offered transfers to Polaris' plant in Spirit Lake, Iowa, which will make both Victory and Indian motorcycles.
The acquisition builds Polaris' presence in the $4 billion heavyweight motorcycle market. Indian is a small player in the industry, with annual sales of just $11 million, but it's a heritage brand that carries considerable clout. Indian has been around for 110 years, while Polaris, whose Victory brand posted sales of about $82 million last year, only starting making motorcycles about 13 years ago.
The Victory brand appeals to performance enthusiasts, a segment that makes up about 21 percent of the market. Die-hards seeking classic brands like Indian account for about 40 percent of industry-wide sales, Wine said.
"Indian is strong where Polaris is weak, and the opposite is also true," Hovorka wrote in a research note. While Indian's brand is strong, it lacks Polaris' resources in research and development, manufacturing, and distribution. "While Polaris has worked hard to build the Victory brand, the Indian brand still has wider awareness," the note added.
Polaris also said Tuesday it will retain about 50 engine assembly jobs at its manufacturing facility in Osceola, Wis., keeping one of the two buildings there open. The company previously announced it would lay off 515 workers and close the whole plant as it shifted work to a new plant in Mexico.
Introducing premium American heritage motorcycles built in Mexico!
MitchellC wrote: Introducing premium American heritage motorcycles built in Mexico!
Exactly. I wants me some of that.
93EXCivic wrote:Dr. Hess wrote: The problem is that if anyone is going to dump 35 large on a bike, the side car better be occupied by two midgets stacked on top of each other wearing an overcoat disguised as a tall person.Fixed that for you.
Fixed that for YOU!
Dr. Hess wrote: The problem is that if anyone is going to dump 35 large on a bike, it had better come with a new Miata.
Fixed again.
93EXCivic wrote:Dr. Hess wrote: The problem is that if anyone is going to dump 35 large on a Harley, they had better check into a nut house.Fixed that for you.
Fixed again.
93EXCivic wrote:Dr. Hess wrote: The problem is that if anyone is going to dump 35 large on a bike, they had better check into a nut house.Fixed that for you.
Actually I take back that statement. If I had the money, I would spend more then that on a Vincent Black Lightning but on a modern bike no way.
If there was an American made cruiser style bike that wasn't completely covered in chrome and didn't sound like complete ass (aka Harleys), I would think it would be worth a look.
I think Polaris may be able to make a go at it. I think BRP would have been a better fit.
Indian has always been under capitalized and has had no viable business model to follow, their quality has been below Harley's as well, which takes considerable effort to be that bad.
No products, no plan, no money = no business. I don't think Polaris will make these mistakes.
35k on a H-D? NEVER, never, ever, ever. Something from England or Italy with a racing heritage.
93EXCivic wrote: If there was an American made cruiser style bike that wasn't completely covered in chrome and didn't sound like complete ass (aka Harleys), I would think it would be worth a look.
Looked at Victory? Don't gut the pipes and they have a few blacked out and mostly paint versions. The Hammer S looks cool.
I really don't like cruisers, there are a few exceptions, but to each his own.
I think it's kinda sad that when both Indian and Harley began then were seriously cutting edge companies. If you research the history of them HD dominated in the 1910's - 1930's in all maner of racing. Had they continued to develop technology like they did when they were new they would by far offer bikes to rival all comers. Instead they basically stopped being cutting edge in the 40's and 50's. Sure they have updated the bikes and kept up with the times (EFI, newer frame designs, 6-speeds, etc.) but it would have been so awesome if they kept up what they did in their own early days. Instead they basically invented the "heavy cuiser" market and have done a wonderful marketing job to exploit it to the fullest.
I think they were attempting to do that with Buell. Some of their design strategies like the fuel-in-frame and radial brakes were novel when compared to the Japanese and Italian manufacturers.
I think that marketing to the typically younger, sport-oriented crowd is just very different than what HD is used to. Price is of course more important. I have read that the average income of an HD rider is $90k per year, which is likely higher than the average of those who ride sport bikes. I am just guessing here, but I bet that sportbike riders are much less brand loyal. For Buell/HD to earn the buyers' dollars, they better have a competitive product at a similar price point.
Or, we could look at it in much simpler marketing terms: For a product to excel in the market, it must be the first, the cheapest, or the best. I don't think that Buell was any of these.
FlightService wrote:93EXCivic wrote: If there was an American made cruiser style bike that wasn't completely covered in chrome and didn't sound like complete ass (aka Harleys), I would think it would be worth a look.Looked at Victory? Don't gut the pipes and they have a few blacked out and mostly paint versions. The Hammer S looks cool. I really don't like cruisers, there are a few exceptions, but to each his own.
That does look very tasty. That is only bike I have seen by them I like. $18k is still a lot for a motorcycle in my mind.
In reply to 93EXCivic:
yeah expensive
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